[ SECRET POST #2713 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2713 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.


__________________________________________________



02.


__________________________________________________



03.


__________________________________________________



04.


__________________________________________________



05.


__________________________________________________



06.


__________________________________________________



07.


__________________________________________________



08.


__________________________________________________



09.


__________________________________________________



10.


__________________________________________________



11.


__________________________________________________



12.


__________________________________________________



13.












Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 084 secrets from Secret Submission Post #388.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

10. http://i.imgur.com/zN80V5i.png

[galerian-ash.livejournal.com]

Guess we run in very different fandoms -- most people I know wouldn't consider tags like "incest" or "dubious consent" to be warnings, heh.

Anyway! I personally don't see the point of tags like that. I mean, if you're looking for fic of a certain fandom/pairing, you're probably gonna be aware what skin color the characters have. It just strikes me as being superfluous, y'know? I'd rather use that space to add other, more relevant tags (especially since I try to avoid cluttering the fic with too many).

But I know it's a big thing for many -- during Yuletide there's even whole collections dedicated to non-white characters. I've never added my fics to them though, but if others want to do it... Hey, whatever floats your boat.

[(Anonymous)]

I personally don't see the point of tags like that. I mean, if you're looking for fic of a certain fandom/pairing, you're probably gonna be aware what skin color the characters have. It just strikes me as being superfluous, y'know?

But not everyone searches by fandom/pairing. Two or three people downthread have said they'll search on the Character of Color tag to find new fic.

And I think it's potentially even more useful to be able to search on multiple tags of which the Character of Color tag is just one. Like, say you're interested in finding fics with both the "Character of Color" and the "Don't Have to Know Canon" tags:

http://archiveofourown.org/works?utf8=%E2%9C%93&work_search%5Bsort_column%5D=revised_at&work_search%5Bother_tag_names%5D=Don%27t+Have+to+Know+Canon&work_search%5Bquery%5D=&work_search%5Blanguage_id%5D=&work_search%5Bcomplete%5D=0&commit=Sort+and+Filter&tag_id=Character%28s%29+of+Color

Pretty handy, right?

[(Anonymous)]

Or they use those tags to make it easier for people searching for stories with those specific traits.

This is like that whole kerfuffle about tagging bottom!X where fans got all riled up because they equated it with a "warning" when really I'm quite happy when people tag shit like that because I can easily ferret it out and enjoy a good read.

[darkmanifest]

This. I regard the tags as advertisements that enable me to filter for what I do and don't want to read. Being able to do a pan-fandom search for kinks, tropes, and character types is great, which you can't do with character names alone.

[(Anonymous)]

Honestly though, if you are looking for a fic featuring 'POC character' and/or 'POC's point of view", you either a) already have a character and fandom in mind and can just go to those tags OR b) are looking for a story in which the POV character being of color actually has a point, as specified in the secret. So I don't really see how superfluously tagging a story with 'POC' will help in either case.

[queerwolf]

I agree with all of this except the last part. Sure, there are tons of superfluous tags used all the time, but tags aren't necessarily warnings. They can tell you what's in the fic in terms of setting, kinks, etc. so you know more if a certain fic will appeal to you.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh woah I was about to make this exact secret!

So needless to say, I'm 100% agreeing.

[forgottenjester]

Honestly, I don't think those tags are the worst. I hate tumblr tags much more. However, it does make me feel awkward when a person slaps something like that on for absolutely no reason. Like... is there a point system I'm missing out on and you're trying to collect? I've seen it used appropriately before but it's super rare.

As for the tags = warnings debate... I'm not getting into that.

[(Anonymous)]

Tangentially related but I have to say that I really hate dubcon as a tag. I mean it can mean anything from one party did not say yes the three asked time to full on rape. It is so useless as a warning or even a note of content

/end rant

[(Anonymous)]

That's why you also read the summary.

[(Anonymous)]

The only time the term dubcon makes sense to me is when you don't know if the person consented. Like if it's a weird point of view that wouldn't cover it or you're missing that scene in the story.

[(Anonymous)]

As a reader, I just assume that every dubcon tag means non-con (usually with bonus in-story protestations of "it wasn't actually rape even though I said 'no' and he didn't stop, b/c I'm pretty sure I could've gotten away if I'd really wanted to"). Nine times out of ten, I'm correct in my assumption.

[(Anonymous)]

I guess it boils down to what you as the fic author thing people searching on the "Canon Character of Color" tag are actually looking for.

I get what you're saying here. The whole construct of the Person Of Color requires (or seems to require?) a power structure to serve as its context. A Japanese person in Japan doing in-Japan things is not, generally speaking, operating in the face of a power structure that systematically oppresses them because of their race.

So I guess I agree with you. I wouldn't use that tag on my anime fic in the case of an all-Japanese-cast-in-Japan canon.

Of course, there do exist anime where there are undeniably characters of color, but that's not what you're talking about anyway.

It's an interesting problem.

[(Anonymous)]

To the point about using those tags when they don't have direct bearing on the focus of the story: I kind of mostly agree, but I've also used tags like 'Female Protagonist' and 'Female Character in Command' to hunt down new fandoms/characters that I might be interested in, so I can also see a use for doing so in that sense?

To the point about associating tags with warnings: I use the AO3 tags as sort of a secondary, less focused summary system, highlighting tropes of interest in the story. So, yes, I use it for warnings, but also as an advertisement. Things like 'comrades in arms', 'magic and science', 'wing kink', 'alternate universe', 'enemies to lovers', 'spies and secret agents', 'rescue', 'protectiveness', etc, are to draw in people who like those sorts of things, while things like 'violence', 'dubious consent', 'aftermath of torture', etc are to warn people what they're getting themselves into in the process.

Of course, this being fandom, you can also handily swap those lists and also get a viable reading. One person's warning is another person's advertisement, after all ...

[(Anonymous)]

when I see tags about the color of a specific character it's a good warning to stay away from it, because it's been written by a teenaged SJW and isn't worth my time. In no situation ever requires that information to be in a tag, whether it's a character that's canonically a certain color, your magical ~~original female character of color~~ or a "raceflip". And lbr if it's fic, raceflipping is stupid to begin with. In art I can get it, but there's no point in changing the color of a character unless you're looking for brownie points or a place to vent about unrelated personal issues.

[kallanda_lee]

I still can't quite figure out tags. Mostly I use things that I think people might be "into".

[(Anonymous)]

I agree with you 100%. I can't trust people who focus on race in a canon where at least 98% of the characters are not white and who live in their country of origin where they are the majority.

[(Anonymous)]

For the record, I don't have a problem with any of those tags, but why do you have a problem with the "Canon - Anime" tag? That's super useful information to have as a reader in fandoms that have very different characterizations and plotlines in the anime vs. the manga.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't get the point of people doing that because if you know the source you know what races the characters are. Labeling it would only seem necessary if you were going to focus heavily on it or were writing a racebent story for whatever reason. IDK maybe people could find new fandoms with POC characters by searching like that but it's seems like an awfully convoluted way to go about it.

I don't consider tags warnings though. To me it's little summations of the story so you know what to search for. Like there's nothing bad about an AU, it's just a label so some people might want to read and others would avoid based on taste. People label fluff and first kiss too.

[arcadiaego]

Tags are used for people to search for fic, not just to outline character traits.

[(Anonymous)]

Me, too! It's ridiculous.

[caffeine_buzz]

I don't really get tagging anime fics with 'POC' either. I tend to work on the assumption that people who are looking for fics about characters of color are aware that anime exists and that much of it involves Japanese characters living in Japan, so why not just look in the anime section instead of the 'character of color' tag? And if you don't watch anime, then it seems odd to be looking at fics for it. I know people sometimes read stuff for fandoms they aren't in, but even then I'd think someone wanting to read about characters of color would probably have something different in mind than 'stars native Japanese characters living in Japan.' And if they were looking for a new fandom to get into that has characters of color, and knowing, again, that anime often involves Japanese characters in Japan, wouldn't it make more sense to ask for recs somewhere so you can find a series that might fit your tastes?

[(Anonymous)]

Agreeing with some of the anons here, I would use that tag (as a reader) to look for fic that has people who resemble me.

As a fanfic writer/reader (and POC), it's generally hard to find fic (well written at that) that does have a POC (that's not a Marysue). In response to those who mention "but it's not in canon", personally, I don't dig the race flip, I just look for stories that have OFCs of color, because that's the kind of story I want to read (and if I want it to be a self insert--shamelessly admitting it here--then damn it, I want the character to look like me and perhaps even share some cultural aspects with me. One can only read 'he stared into her blue eyes, her blonde hair billowing in the wind' or my favorite 'alabaster skin' before becoming disenchanted by the subject matter. Granted if it's a good story, that won't matter, but it depends what you're looking for).

[(Anonymous)]

...but what about the zillions of tags like "backstory" and "romance" and "humor" and "first time" and "dogs" that people...commonly use...? I mean, I guess some people might consider them "warnings" the way others consider "rape" to be an advertisement but. I feel like fandom as a whole has been using tags for things other than "warnings" for years and years now...

IDK, I think a lot of people (me included) just tag descriptively for "things contained in the fic" (like, i have tagged for "historical fiction" and "romans" on fic where canon era is ancient Rome, and sure it's redundant, but sometimes people just want to read fic about Romans and might not care if it's a specific fandom or an AU of a fandom set in modern NYC). Or they might be in the fandom and want to filter OUT canon era because they only read AUs. I don't use the character identity tags much anyone, but I think assuming that people who do are trying to score brownie points is overthinking it a bit.