[ SECRET POST #3452 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3452 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.
[Courage, the Cowardly Dog]



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02.


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03.
[Vampire Princess Miyu]


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04.
[Powerpuff Girls]


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05.
[The Mummy and The Mummy Returns, Evelyn/Imhotep]


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06.
[Orphan Black]


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07.
[Lost in Translation]


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08.



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09.











Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 10 secrets from Secret Submission Post #493.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

09. http://i.imgur.com/JzEJjrn.png

[(Anonymous)]

That's so funny, 'it's JUST a couple thousand people."

[(Anonymous)]

And out of that JUST a couple thousand people no one will be influenced into thinking [insert bad thing here] is normal.

Millions of people play video games. Do you know how many people playing those violent video games have gone on to shoot real people? 0. And video games are WAYYYYY more immersive than a shitty fanfic some 17 year old wrote to masturbate to.

[(Anonymous)]

You don't think anyone who's ever shot anyone has ever played a video game?

[(Anonymous)]

Those who know of and read fanfic are an incredibly niche group usually comprised of teenage girls. Normies aren't influenced or affected by it in any way.

[(Anonymous)]

Hear, hear. I will critique mainstream media within an inch of its life [at the same time that I enjoy the heck out of it], but fic strikes me as very different. Maybe it's that fic seems so much more self-aware? Seeing stuff like constant rape threats or Babies Ever After in mainstream media makes those tropes feel like they're supposed to be the default, the way the world really works, because it will help things sell. In fic, those kind of tropes feel less normalizing and more self-indulgent, less about saying 'this is the way the world is' and more about saying 'this is the world I'm interested in consuming right now.' If that makes any sense.

[(Anonymous)]

Prudes will be prudes. Block 'em and move on, and pray you can find a few good friends who can differentiate between fic and reality.

[nightscale]

Personally so long as something is aware of how fucked up it is I'm cool with it(even if I'm not into it myself), if it's not that can bother me and this applies to both fic and the general media.

[kallanda_lee]

I'll up you one.

I do not think that even canon media has the role/function of being the moral high-ground (sure, it depends on the medium, and the audience) - but inherently, I think any story should be able to be told. I think there's too much emphasis on "keeping people's feelings safe" now - well, the reality is, SOME media might not be for you, and that's okay.

[(Anonymous)]

That's a very ballsy opinion to have right now. I respect you for voicing it.

[(Anonymous)]

yeah, I'm sick of this infantilizing of people. I trust people to tell the difference between fact and fiction. I love horror movies and books, scarier the better. I abhor violence in real life and can always tell the difference.

I keep seeing directed towards women especially "these books are harmful for women!"
cool, glad you are speaking up and judging what adult women can get off to. Glad you know they are too stupid to tell the difference between fact and fiction. It's not like we have centuries of history where we told women what they could and could not read because it might "harm them" (or read at all.)

There are books I find gross, sexist, distasteful, even harmful! but I DON'T GET TO TELL PEOPLE what they can read!
because that's the most harmful of all in my opinion.

[(Anonymous)]

I wholeheartedly agree with this sentiment.

[feotakahari]

There's a difference between silencing and criticizing. The Turner Diaries, for instance, can absolutely exist, but that doesn't mean it can't be criticized: http://archive.adl.org/learn/ext_us/turner_diaries.html

[(Anonymous)]

I agree completely.

[(Anonymous)]

It's not always abut keeping people's feelings safe- it's about keeping actual people safe. Normalization through media is absolutely a thing and it contributes to everything from racism to xenophobia to rape culture.

[herpymcderp]

Fuck the haters, write what you want.

This is kink, not reality. If someone gets inspired to commit rape because they read a kink fic, that person had bigger fucking problems to begin with.

[(Anonymous)]

I definitely have different standards for fanfiction. But I don't know if it's just a numbers thing.

I think my experience with fanfic is that it's wish fulfillment and personal in a way that canon works aren't.

[(Anonymous)]

It's the same type of people who want to ban video games and books for potentially negatively influencing people. Even though most people know how to separate fiction from reality. The only people that might emulate fiction is the really young kids, but their parents should be keeping a closer eye on them and telling them right from wrong.

Otherwise if people are that easily influenced by what they see then anything could trigger that behavior, doesn't mean we have to censor it for everyone else.

[(Anonymous)]

Unless said fic/writer is openly encourageing and supporting incest and rape or whatever else, I don't really care.

[darkmanifest]

Huh. Maybe I could argue that fandom as a whole normalizes dangerously fanatic behavior - it's right there in the name - in young people and shouldn't be tolerated.

[(Anonymous)]

NA

...Honestly? I know you probably meant this as a devil's advocate sort of thing, but I think it kind of does. It's showing in this entire thread, people are getting SO up in arms about potentially being "kink shamed" (I can't help but feel this secret is related to the recent influx of secrets about how normalizing abusive relationships and characters isn't cool, unless OP is talking specifically about kink and did a bad job portraying that) that they double down and act like the media we consume doesn't contribute anything.

And the whole "fic is different than canon!!!" thing makes me laugh. You know the difference between a fic writer and a novelist? Getting noticed by the publishing industry. You don't get a magical moral guardian button when you become published, authors like E.L. James should show that pretty clearly.

I dunno. I think this whole subject is a gray area and people on both sides, whether trying to argue that EVERYTHING is bad and should be banned, or that EVERYTHING under the sun should be allowed to be created with impunity and free from criticism (and that's really what a lot of this is about, "you're hurting my feelings when you say that rape fics are bad because I'm sexually excited by them!", these people are JUST as bad as the "my feelings are hurt because I think rape is terrible so it should NEVER be allowed to be written about" type people).

[mrs_don_draper]

I totally agree with you. Since when does fanfic represent reality? Kinks and tropes and cliches are just that and are totally harmless when properly tagged and warned for.

[(Anonymous)]

This is a debate that I have problems with, myself. On one hand, I have a non-con kink and have no problem reading (and even writing) non-con, as long as, in my mind it's dealt with in the "right way" as in establishing that what has happened is wrong.
I have a friend, however who refuses to read any non-con whatsoever and sees it all as "wrong".
However, I see how the media (including fanfiction) can reflect some of the seedier aspects of society. If it's a deliberate thing, to make a point about how bad/disgusting something is, that's great. But so often, I get the feeling that the writer/maker of the media doesn't even realise that they are actually producing something that is "problematic".
For example, the universally loathed "50 Shades of Grey" is problematic, in that it romanticises abuse. Yes, people can read it, sure. They can do what they want. Is it just a 'fantasy', or does it actually reflect or, to go further, promote women to accept an abusive relationship as 'romantic'?
I really don't know.
But I think it is a debate worth having, rather than just saying 'let people read/watch/listen to what they want.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh wow, I literally just replied to mrs_don_draper with a comment that sounds a whole lot like yours. o.O

[(Anonymous)]

I think the difference is definitely in the media's self-awareness! 50 Shades of Gray does not warn you for abusive dynamics, it just calls itself a BDSM book; a fic is usually self-aware and all about making a big show OF the nasty, sick or degenerate aspects. Is it 'normalizing' to call rape rape? I don't think depicting something is normalizing, or else any media of anything bad would do so. I think normalizing is in not treating it as an irregular or bad thing.

I think a lot of media DOES normalize by NOT labeling things, or calling attention to something being bad. A lot of dynamics in popular media are presented as romantic, such as possessive behavior, or romanticizing unequal power dynamics... I feel very uncomfortable when I read a fic that WASN'T tagged for rape/noncon but very much has coercion in it, because it means the OP doesn't register what they wrote as being non-consensual. It implies their idea of consent is inaccurate, which is scary. Unfortunately also common because of how more popular media ISN'T labeling these things as rape!

If anything, the self-awareness of fic makes me give it a pass, because at least people know what they are writing, make no mistake about it. A lot of skeevy show-writers are writing their sexual fantasies and not second-guessing themselves on the nature of what they're depicting... fandom is generally like "yeah, I know this is gross/bad but I'm horny for that".

This is from the perspective of someone who really enjoys non-con works, but for whom an untagged fic can absolutely twist my stomach because I wasn't braced for the content. The difference feels huge to me, between someone normalizing something, or treating it like it's not fucked up, VS engaging in a filthy fantasy knowingly.