[ SECRET POST #2082 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2082 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.


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03.
[Fate/Zero]


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04.


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[ ----- SPOILERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]












05. [SPOILERS for Journey Into Mystery/Everything Burns]



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06. [SPOILERS for Avengers]



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07. [SPOILERS for Sweeney Todd]



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08. [SPOILERS]



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[ ----- TRIGGERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]














09. [WARNING for depression/suicide]

[Wilby Wonderful (2004)]


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10. [WARNING for abuse]

[True Blood]


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11. [WARNING for rape]



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12. [WARNING for suicide/self-harm]

[Alex Gaskarth/All Time Low]


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13. [WARNING for abuse]



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14. [WARNING for abuse/bullying]



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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #297.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ],.
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

02. http://i.imgur.com/9VLgI.png

[(Anonymous)]

You have to look at the entire situation. Gone With The Wind is a completely different situation than MLP. You're creating wank where there's no need for wank. (As far as I know. I'm only familiar with the show a bit and not at all with the fandom.)

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think so, because Applejack and her relatives are the only ponies in the show who have that accent, so it is different from the other ponies' accents. The problem with Gone with the Wind, etc., is that the white and black people would both have had Southern accents, but only the black peoples' were written phonetically, which made it look like black people have an ignorant-sounding dialect while white people speak perfect formal English.

Unicorn Master Race Reporting in.

[insanenoodlyguy]

Stop thinking so hard.

Stupid Earth Ponies dont' know how to talk right. You may as well be accurate with it.

[birdboy2000]

Phoneticization has a long, rich history in literature, and is quite frequently used to express local dialect. Though I personally can't stand it because it's a pain in the ass to read.

I haven't read Gone with the Wind, but I'm pretty sure the beef people have with it is with all the lost cause romanticization of the antebellum south, of which the use of phonetic speech is only a symptom.

[(Anonymous)]

I thought people didn't like phonetically written accents because they're fucking annoying to read

but I'm probably just bitter because I'm a veteran of rogue/gambit fic. OH GOD, THE ROGUE/GAMBIT FIC

/sob

[intrigueing]

no1curr. Applejack's not a representative of an oppressed segment of the RL human population, so it doesn't carry any implications by default.

[(Anonymous)]

OT but by virtue of being an earth pony, does this mean Applejack is the most unprivileged of the ponies? do the unicorn and pegasus ponies have privilege? and there earth pony SJ crusaders?

[visp]

I'm going to say "yes, yes using phoneticization is always classist and racist and any other -ist you can think of," but that's only because I find it so very annoying to read that I'd say most anything to make it stop.

P.S. MLP really has enough wank already. You wanna be all SJW? Find two bronies a day that are being disgustingly misogynistic and harassing and make a short "Dude, not cool," post.

[(Anonymous)]

I...I have no idea what I just read.

This is about MLP right?

*scratches head*

[(Anonymous)]

You answered this in your own damn secret.

If the same accent is written phonetically for a black person and formally for a white person, yes, that's fucking racist. Applejack is a pony who does have a different accent from the rest of her friends, despite having grown up in exactly the same place as most of them. The accent is intended to make her sound country because she's a pony who farms and this is a kids show, not to make her look poor or stupid. Writing it phonetically is not problematic beyond how stupid it looks and hard to read it is.

...honestly, you gave it that much thought and DIDN'T figure this out? Are you fandom-hates-women?

[(Anonymous)]

i don't really think it's classist or racist by default. it could be? depending on the context.

[(Anonymous)]

Overthinking typical farmer accents in a children's show.

Farmers, y u so oppressed?

[(Anonymous)]

But in Equestria, only a few ponies talk with that accent, not all of them, ergo, it's not really classist for people to write the accent phonetically. It's not like Gone with the Wind, where everyone has the same accent, but it's just typed out differently. Applejack and her family actually do sound different than most of the other ponies.

Also I agree with the "creating wank where there is none" sentiment upthread. The MLP fandom has enough wank allllll on it's own without needing to really overthink some small things and create wank where there really isn't any.

[(Anonymous)]

...I always thought it was because most of the time phonic spelling of accents is a huge pain in the ass to read, and, as often as not, ends up not sounding quite right anyways. [Admittedly, phonic spelling is a pet peeve of mine anyways because just...jfc. There are other ways to get an accent across without the eye bleed.]

That said...Why are you even comparing how it was done in Gone With the Wind with MLP? Those are two entirely different contexts. Gone With the Wind was doing it in a racist manner, yes. One the other hand, unless it's being applied to all earth ponies [which would deviate from the canon anyways], it's not being used the same way. So...there's really no reason to compare the two.

[(Anonymous)]

What, no mention of Zecora yet in this thread?

[truxillogical]

Eh, people more studied on the subject than I am have written pretty good essays about how socially problematic phonetically rendering accents can be. In fact, Gail Simone, I think, had a pretty good one a while back.

In the case of MLP, I wouldn't call it problematic. I would probably call it bad writing. It's one thing to drop the "g" at the end of a word and replace it with an apostrophe, as I'll be demonstratin' here. It's anothah thang entirely ta fah-netickally wraht th' whole durn speech, Ah think.

If you're not Brian Jaques writing impossible-to-understand moles in a way that you have successfully done for years, I'd advise against it because it makes for harder to read dialogue, and it's much sloppier than it needs to be. An accent really can be much more successfully rendered with word choices and sentence structure. And replacing "I" with "Ah" (the most common thing I see) seems like a good idea in theory--lots of Southerners, myself included, do talk like that. But visually, it doesn't work so well, and it's just not necessary. If you're writing Applejack, people know what her accent sounds like; I imagine they'd be more interested in whether or not you can write dialogue that sounds like something she'd say.

And that's my way-too-much-thought-given (any) answer.

[kaileighblue]

I kinda get what you're saying. I do so hate when people try to phonetically spell accents. The character isn't saying "Ahm" instead of "I'm".

Though I agree with a posted above. If you actually say things differently writing it that way might help people get a feel for the character/s? Then again I absolutely hate it when the newspaper quotes someone who talks horribly. Fix their grammar please. :(

[(Anonymous)]

I know it drives me fucking crazy to try to read X-Men fanfic based around Rogue where they've phonetically written out her accent. What the ever fucking fuck? I know what her accent sounds like, I don't need you to dumb it down for me. It just makes it harder to read.

[(Anonymous)]

Is it racist or classist? Possibly, somebody better versed in this stuff can answer that question a lot better than I can.
But it's damn hard to read... You don't need to go full phonetic spellings and weird grammar to portray a character's dialect, just type out their dialog normally and use the dialect's slang when appropriate. I think most people will understand Applejack's accent just from her using words and phrases like "y'all" and "darn tootin'" and stuff like that.

[campesino]

>MLP
>wank

im laughing so hard jesus christ

[(Anonymous)]

I took a Short Story Writing class, and my professor suggested that there was a preferable middle ground: Don't write every single word phonetically but rather just the occasional word. Like in "A Good Man is Hard to Find," we know the Misfit has an accent, because he says things like "Nome" (instead of "No, ma'am") and "reckernized," but not every word he says is phoneticized. This is much easier on the reader (and less polarizing) than going all-out, like Charles Dickens's nigh-unreadable phonetic Cockney accents.

Austrian perspective

[(Anonymous)]

I know this is mostly about American accents, but as someone who has to see German accents constantly typed out, I'm extremely annoyed. Guess what, I can pronounce the "th" and "w". In fact, where does the whole "w pronounced as v" even come from? I've never heard anyone here do it. It's usually the other way round, "v" is pronounced as "w". (For example, "very" is pronounced in a way that makes it sound like "wary".)

Yes, I'm sure you can still hear my hopefully mild accent, and it might get more pronounced when I try to speak faster or when I'm upset, but just replacing every "th" with "z" and every "w" with "v", as it is always done, does not reflect the way I speak (and the way other German-speaking people speak) at all.

Are there people with a really noticeable accent who can't pronounce their th's? Yes, especially among older people or people who are just starting to learn English. But does everybody do it? No.

Also, for the love of god, don't have your German-speaking characters spice up their dialogue with random German words. Especially not Fräulein. We stopped using Fräulein in the 90s. Elder people may still use it out of habit, but younger people don't. As for swearing, we use some English swears (fuck and shit, mostly) so it's fine to use those. I know that not having a person reply with "ja" and "nein" all the time should be a no-brainer, but considering that one of the best-selling books currently has a character who constantly says "dios mio", I thought it would be worth mentioning.

[(Anonymous)]

Wait, wait wait, writing accents phonetically is considered racist/classist now? Guess I'm screwed then, I do that with anyone who has a strong accent (Scottish/Irish/Southern US/Mexican/French etc) because I like seeing that in written fiction. *shrug*

[netbug009]

I've never looked at it from a social POV, but as a writer, I tend to write the accents of characters in fanfics based on movies or television, even though I don't normally write them in original work unless the way a word is pronounced is particularly important.

I guess it's because unlike with regular writing, when you're writing fic based on a fandom with sound, people already have a certain way they expect the character to talk. Like, I write Cars fic, and if Mater's speech is as perfectly spelled as everyone else I get REALLY thrown off, even though not writing out accents is a legitimate style.