[ SECRET POST #2094 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2094 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.


__________________________________________________



02.


__________________________________________________



03.


__________________________________________________



04.


__________________________________________________



05.


__________________________________________________



06.


__________________________________________________



07.


__________________________________________________



08.


__________________________________________________



09.


__________________________________________________



10.


__________________________________________________



11.


__________________________________________________



12.


__________________________________________________



13.


__________________________________________________



14.


__________________________________________________



15.


__________________________________________________



16.


__________________________________________________










Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 042 secrets from Secret Submission Post #299.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 - ships it ], [ 1 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

Those characters don't even look a race though, they just look like really tan white people.

[(Anonymous)]

OP
From context, the first has no stated race (but I would surmise African ancestry), the second is Catalan, and the third has implied Indian ancestry. In all three cases giving them particularly racial features would be quite a departure from the overall style of the show. Not that there aren't plenty of anime out there which do manage that kind of thing, and do it well (Naoki Urasawa, rawr) but cartoonish, averaged-out features like these don't really take away from the fact that the characters are definitely intended to be non-white, in my opinion.

[(Anonymous)]

da
the third has implied Indian ancestry
Loran is Moonrace, where did you get that from?

[(Anonymous)]

OP
Loran's name is actually always given in offical materials as Rolan, which is apparently a legit Indian name. I got told off by an Indian fan for assuming he was anything but. Moonrace is Moonrace, sure, and that's what's relevant in Turn A, but for the purpose of defining ethnicity, the Moonrace are originally from Earth, and he has an Indian name and an appearance that is as Indian as any Caucasian character's appearance is Caucasian. I've looked into it a bit, and if he's anything, that's probably what he is.

[(Anonymous)]

First one is African


lolwat

[(Anonymous)]

That's interesting; would you say Catalans are POC?

[(Anonymous)]

OP
I think that's subjective, but based upon my reading of The Count of Monte Cristo, which is the source material for Gankutsuou, Mercedes is perceived as physically differing from her caucasian peers, and is portrayed as being from a very different sociological background, with potentially differing values and so forth. To be honest, POC is a term which isn't even used in my country, but I thought my intentions would be understood from that context. I could just as easily have said I was blogging about "characters who are brown."

[(Anonymous)]

Acording to Tumblr, everybody BUT white people are POC, so...

[(Anonymous)]

i think it depends. there are white catalans and non-white catalans. my mom, hell that entire side of my family, would be classified as "brown", but when i go home i do see catalans who just look like white people. i would say that in spain being a white catalan might be slightly "less" but definitely not outside of it, and not on the same level as being a straight up brown spaniard.

[(Anonymous)]

To quote another anon on here;

"Darker skin does not a POC make".

[(Anonymous)]

OP
You know, this was meant to be a secret about my mild paranoia that somebody would think I was messing with shit I didn't know anything about, but I think I'm going to come right out and say what I think about that, whether or not this risks starting a shitstorm: that's bollocks. Are you saying Mercedes isn't POC because she's drawn? Well at least she's a damn sight darker than every live-action Mercedes I've ever seen. Loran, the first non-white(/pale) protagonist in Gundam, isn't up to your standards of non-whiteness? Tell that to everybody who was thrilled to see him, to everyone who cosplays him. These are shows with a set range of possible facial features due to art style, which is totally legit - when you're watching a shoujo or a josei or a shounen show, you don't tend to see highly-detailed facial features - that's more the forte of seinen or gekiga art. Unless you want total gonk characters who stand out by miles, you're going to have fewer racially identifying features when the art is low in detail, which definitely doesn't mean the characters aren't POC. It's not that it can't happen - One Piece, for instance, has a variety of races amongst its cast members, and some have very distinctive features, but that's definitely a quirk of the art, which some people even thought seemed offensive when it was first licensed for Western distribution. I find it hard to believe that you seem to think I should only go for caracaturised characters, or characters from only one kind of show, or only characters from shows with really realistic art. That would be limiting and strange.

[(Anonymous)]

Catalán = northern Spain = European = white, for godsakes.

Maybe they didn't reply because they took one look at what you consider "POC" and decided you're kind of an idiot.

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

As a POC myself, I find it kind of insulting that white people think that taking a standard white face with European features and darkening it = POC. That's what bothers me. POC are not just white people with dark skin! In fact, there are plenty of POC out there who can and are lighter than some white people. For example there are plenty of Middle Eastern and Indian (to name a few) people who are lighter-skinned than some Europeans from places like Greece or Italy. But guess what, that doesn't make then white! Because they still have their Indian/Middle-Eastern/Etc. features!
Simplifying the issue to point that light skin = white, and dark skin = POC is highly insulting and it erases light-skinned POC too.

But of course what do I know about these things? I'm just a simple colored girl! Clearly, you know better...

[(Anonymous)]

Personally, I'll take dark skin of dubious origins over straight-up pale blond people everywhere any day. But I guess that's just me.

[(Anonymous)]

WTF. Catalans are from Spain! They are European and they do have white privilege.

The reason why didn't respond to is clear. It's not cause you're white, hun. It's because you're an ignorant white person with absolutely no understanding of POC.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, they have *less* of this magical privilege than Castillian Spaniards. It's kind analagous to the Irish/English thing... In the big scheme of things, everybody we're discussing is white, but some of the groups have been on the crappy end of the power dynamic.

/lol race wank

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

I totally agree with you, anon! But overall it doesn't change the fact that they're white though. Likewise, in countries like China there are Asian ethnic majorities that have more privileged than other Asian ethnic minorities, but it doesn't change the fact that although the dominant ethnic group (in this instance, Han Chinese) has privilege, it doesn't make Han Chinese people stop being POC.

/lol race wank indeed

DA

[(Anonymous)]

idk whether the character is supposed to be considered white or not but that picture sure as hell doesn't look white in the slightest to me.

[childings.livejournal.com]

Well, if you know anything about the history of Spain you'd realize that parts of it (Córdoba) used to be a Muslim caliphate -- there are plenty of people with North African ancestry there, it's not like they all just disappeared when the country gradually went completely Christian or anything

I'm not saying it doesn't make darker skinned Spainards white but it certainly isn't as cut and dry and you want to make it (and arguments like this make it pretty obvious how socially determined race is in general -- I mean, in ancient/classical times race wasn't even a concept, people just categorized you by nationality/where you hailed from)

Are Basques white?

Also, whenever someone like you says the words "hun" "honey" "bb" I tend to discredit anything you say as being of any merit

[(Anonymous)]

The whiteness of Spaniards is especially relevant to current racial issues in the Latin American world. White privilege, skin-lightening, and a ton of racial issues exist in Latin America because of the white colonialism that went on. Skin-lightening is an especially hot topic these days.

I know that on a scientific level that race is a very flimsy concept. But in recent history, European Spaniards are considered white, have white privilege and (most importantly) they have used their white privilege to oppress non-whites.

Trying to argue that the Spaniards are not white is a huge slap in the face to anyone who has been the victim of Spanish colonialism and all the issues it's caused.

[(Anonymous)]

there are plenty of people with North African ancestry there, it's not like they all just disappeared when the country gradually went completely Christian or anything

Actually, they kinda did. The white, Christian Spaniards because very hostile towards the Moors and the Jews in the Medieval Era. Throughout the history of Spanish Christendom, they were constantly trying to ostracize and drive out the Moors. Most Muslims in Spain left for countries with a Muslim majority where they would be free of persecution. Those that didn't got to deal with the Spanish Inquisition.

Ugh, you can't imagine some of the nasty things I have read when I'm reviewing historical documents. The white Spaniards were not fond of the non-whites at all.

[(Anonymous)]

Except OP wasn't trying to say that she was collecting characters with no white privilege? She made it clear her sole aim was to collect characters who weren't super-duper white/pale like most of the characters, so that people who also weren't super-duper white/pale could cosplay someone more easily. If she was collecting POC characters to be, well, examples of POC, then this comment would be completely valid and called for. But... she wasn't.

[(Anonymous)]

That shade of brown I would say makes for pretty good POC cosplay options as far as anime goes. When anime tries to actually portray non-japanese status via facial features... things get weird.

[(Anonymous)]

uh, yeah. every time someone goes "but they don't look black!" all I can think of is that one student from Pani Poni Dash.

You know. This one: http://www.animecharactersdatabase.com/character.php?id=13544

[(Anonymous)]

Only if your brain defaults to white as the norm. That is some serious brown, not the orange-brown of suntan.