[ SECRET POST #2643 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2643 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 075 secrets from Secret Submission Post #378.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I've noticed (in a lot of fandoms) that there are lots of AUs that romanticise the hell out of poverty and homelessness, which by its nature comes from a privileged (I know that's a dirty SJW word around here, but it applies), middle-class point of view. As someone that lived for several years on the very edge of homelessness, it pisses me off to no end.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

What do you mean by romanticizing?

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

Like using poverty as a way to convey that the characters are "purer" or "truer to themselves" or than the materially "obsessed". As though poverty or homelessness is a exercise in character building. No one is actually a better person (nor do they become one) through being destitute.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

DA

I'm another that likes reading about destitute characters, but not because it makes them good people. If it's an intelligent character, it makes them more harshly practical people who are forced to have their priorities together, morals aside. Fictional characters being destitute is interesting because it makes the story a lot more stark and brings out character traits that might not have been as evident, had they been left in a comfortable uneventful upper/middle class life... just like every other situation with lots of physical and mental strain strain (war, death of a loved one, forced to move to a different country, et cetera) in which one could throw a character.

Would you call that romanticizing it?

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

"deal with or describe in an idealized or unrealistic fashion; make (something) seem better or more appealing than it really is."

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I love reading about financial struggles. And I'm well off. So, sorry I'm one of that people who likes romanticizing such things. In my defense I give to local homeless charities. And I get the difference between reality and writing.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

oops, misfire. I'll just post it where it should've gone to.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

here do you need some help patting yourself on the ass

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

Huh. What about romanticized poverty appeals to you? I can't imagine someone well off wanting to be even as poor as I am, and I have a roof over my head. I have massive dental problems that might eventually kill me that I can't afford to get treated, for example, and my family's house is falling down around our ears because we can't afford to get anything repaired. Sometimes when our gas and electricity get cut off, I heat water on our wood stove and wash out of a bucket. I know lots of other people who put off necessary medical care from lack of funds, or who live in fear of missing a day of work because they could be fired, or who live in their cars and have to wash up as best they can in public restrooms. New clothes are a luxury I feel guilty about, and for some of my friends, fresh fruit and vegetables or meat not out of a can are too. What about that sounds appealing? (I'd reply to this where you reposted it, except I didn't see you repost it anywhere.)

Re: Classism in fandom

[dethtoll]

I can't imagine someone well off wanting to be even as poor as I am

I can. I've met them. They are the worst people alive. Don't even get me started on freeganism.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think enjoying any fandom tropes is bad? Like no one blames people who read fanfics about royalty.
I like added drama. It's romantic in a sense that adventuring with only a tent, a blanket and a pan is romantic. Overcoming difficulties.
Honestly, I don't even see a problem here. I see why you personally wouldn't like this trope as you face similar things on a daily basis. I don't like sick!fics because it hits too close to home. Is it about misrepresentation?

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think there's anything wrong with that at all? A lot of things can be interesting, or even "romantic" when you're not there - that's the point. I'd imagine being a soldier in war, being in prison, being trapped on a deserted island - whatever, a lot of things can be fun to imagine and even seem exciting, when in reality they suck.

Of course, a lot of people are actually homeless and living in poverty, and it is extremely important to know the difference between this fantasy of ~freedom~ and the harsh reality of it. But as long as you can separate fantasies from reality... and that applies to pretty much any category of fiction.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

yes, this.

Re: Classism in fandom

[nyxelestia]

I actually can see where the latter misconception comes from - there are some areas that make allowances for people to buy 'hot' or prepared foods, and then conservative propaganda tends to smear the situation until people are convinced that taxpayer money is being used to buy Starbucks coffees and meals at the Ritz.

It's a stupid lack of research problem, but given that I've met people who honestly buy into that despite living in a place that would suggest a better understanding of them, I can see why someone might not have realized that they needed to research that in the first place.

The stamps thing, though, confuses the hell out of me.

Re: Classism in fandom

[dreemyweird]

I agree. Once I read a Sherlock fic where a Mary Sue OC was homeless. It was supposed to make her look tough and badass, but it only made it all the more obvious that the author was a white middle-class teenager.

Tbh I was guilty of that when I was a kid. I blame Mark Twain.

ETA: and the curious thing is that our family wasn't really well off. But we were never destitute or even very poor, either.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I think that's natural for little kids, though.

Re: Classism in fandom

[dreemyweird]

Maybe. It may be a part of the reason why Twain is popular in the first place.

I think kids tend to romanticize everything, so that's just one aspect of the general tendency.

Re: Classism in fandom

[inevitableentresol]

I once wrote a fanfic in which the main character was homeless for a time and lived on the street, as I did for a while myself, when younger. I was surprised how many readers were fascinated by that aspect. It's true, they do think it's cool. Especially my teenage readers. The concept of it being cool actually passed me by so hard that I didn't realise what their reaction meant until you explained it just there.

While in many ways, it's interesting to be homeless, in the same way having a broken leg is interesting, it's something that's better reflected on from a more comfortable present. It definitely does not make you badass. More like more vulnerable.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I think for kids and teens, living on the street suggests things like a lack of patental supervision, maybe not having to go to school, etc., and to kids that sort of thing sounds awesome.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

The author could have been black or any other race, just saying. There are middle class people who are not white.

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

It goes both ways on the spectrum, really. I notice AUs that romanticize being a CEO, too, and assume ~rich CEOs~ constantly have money at their fingertips to do whatever they want with and never actually do any work, much less devote a majority of their lives to running a business which 50+ other people's entire livelihoods depend on, which could all collapse at once and wreck everybody if they make the wrong business decisions. No, all rich people have stress-free, wonderful lives. Blech.

I don't mean to say that being rich is harder than being poor, just pointing out the very narrow middle-ish-class perspective that most of these things get written from. It's inaccurately romanticizing both ends. :\

Re: Classism in fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I get what you're saying, even if another anon gives you flack for it. Though I think media does a good job of showing the stresses of well off people, and rich people, but yeah, a lot of well off people have no life outside of their company and that sucks too.

But I too have a rich fantasy, so. :P haha

Re: Classism in fandom

[inevitableentresol]

Depiction of CEOs in most media makes me laugh outright. I know a couple of CEOs, in both large and small companies, and I have to work really hard to suspend disbelief.

The amount of free time that most depiction of CEOs gives them is just stupid. As for spending, most of them are rich, sure, but they're also penny-pinchers. Which is why they're good at their jobs.

Re: Classism in fandom

[inevitableentresol]

I immediately thought of the Derelicte fashion collection in Zoolander, based on the clothes of homeless people. And then finding out this part in the movie was based on a real fashion show.

The distasteful romanticising doesn't only happen in fandom.