[ SECRET POST #3056 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3056 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 062 secrets from Secret Submission Post #437.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Dear F!S Agony Aunt.

What do you do when you are a deeply committed feminist, but your boyfriend is vocally not? How do you make that work? Can you make that work?

Please help.

Morally and Politically Conflicted in Birmingham.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

I think it depends very much on the individual and on the moral stances that he does take and how he acts as a human being. I think there are decent people who are not feminists. I think a relationship like this can work and like all relationships it depends on the people. If he's a decent human being, you can find a way.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Is he nice and for equality? You don't have to be a feminist to care about equality.

Re: Advice Column

[kallanda_lee]

I think you either need to to accept your differences, or call it quits.

However, I don't see how something like that would give trouble in the relationship itself.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

You're going to have to give more detail than that, as there are many different ways to be "not a feminist" ranging from "unrepentant misogynist" to "I'm not feminist because I have issues with the label but am for gender equality"

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Can I just take this moment to express (as someone who identifies as a feminist) how frustrating I find the Internet feminist of denying that the second group of people you mention exists?

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Seriously.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

AYRT

People like to deny that feminism has a predominantly white, upper-middle class, college educated culture along with a shit ton of predominantly white, upper-middle class, college educated history and baggage to go with it. It likes to assume that everyone is approaching gender equality issues from a similar perspective and fails a lot to take into account that not everyone is.

Re: Advice Column

[kaijinscendre]

This is me. I do not identify as feminist but I am all for equality for all genders. It is a shame that every label other than feminist makes people think you are some redpiller (like people saying egalitarian is just code for [internalized] misogynist pigs).

Re: Advice Column

[herpymcderp]

It might just be a question of not identifying with the more vocal and extremist parts of a movement rather than not sharing philosophies/ideals. If this is the case, and your boyfriend is actually a feminist without wanting to call himself one, then it will probably work out. If he's not... well.

Then I'd say it won't.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

your boyfriend is actually a feminist without wanting to call himself one,

This is a bullshit fucking line of reasoning, can we knock it the fuck off with this shit

Re: Advice Column

[herpymcderp]

No. No we can't. There are a hundred reasons for someone to not identify with the feminist movement.

I still consider myself one, but the amount of times someone has tried to oust me or tell me I can't be a feminist because I am a man is staggering. If I were more reactive or had a thinner skin I might have also been pretty discouraged by encountering this kind of discrimination from people calling themselves feminists.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Do you mean he doesn't identify as a feminist, or he ACTUALLY isn't a feminist?

I mean, feminist is just the belief that men and women are equal, so he might still believe that but reject the title.

But if he's actively misogynistic, idk man, maybe you can help him expand his horizons a bit but that'd be a tough date for me.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

I vociferously object to this idea

(I probably could have left it at making this post only twice, but w/e)

My problem is that, one, the idea that feminism is pure and simply a belief in gender equality is just, like, factually not true. It's not. Feminism is a political tendency in society. It's an actually-existing movement with a whole host of arguments and positions and claims, with a really rich intellectual background. It's not just a claim about the equality of men and women. I think that is what many feminists would regard as the core of feminism, but it's not the whole of the idea.

(And, in fact, it's absolutely possible to believe in gender equality and not be a feminist, if for instance you don't believe in a patriarchal society or don't generally believe that women have it worse than men. To be clear I'm not saying that such a belief is right, I'm saying that it's possible, and that it makes it hard to take seriously this line about equality).

Second, I think this whole thing is kind of a really bullshit rhetorical tactic. You can't just define all the light and goodness as being on all your side and then try to use that as an argument for why your side is right. You can't just magically draw a line where all the people who disagree with you actually secretly agree with you (or are awful people). There's something really cheap and almost insulting about it, to me.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Challenge him to a fist fight to defend his views.

Either he wont accept the challenge and you win.

Either he accepts but can't beat you, in which case you win.

or he accepts and beats you, then you know what kind of man he is and you should be able to end the relationship then.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Genius!

Re: Advice Column

[insanenoodlyguy]

What if he leaves her though because he's uncomfortable with a girlfriend who suddenly challanges him to fist fights based on advice on the internet? Then he tells all her friends and they laugh at her because it's a pretty stupid idea?

Then she loses!

Re: Advice Column

[raspberryrain]

These are all terrible ideas.

1) Cheating in an argument by abusing socially constructed privilege.
2) "Might makes right."
3) Blaming someone else for a physical confrontation you asked for, with a side of confusing two very different senses of "to beat."

Re: Advice Column

[dethtoll]

Does he reject the term but not the fundamentals like equality? Because "feminist" is a dirty word in this country largely due to the acts of anti-feminists.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

*throws up hands in exasperation*

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Please don't pretend that some groups of feminists are not massive assholes. You are just letting them get away with their shitty behavior because you don't want to admit that some feminists are bad.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

My sister was more oppossed to me "making it an issue" than feminism per se.
Idk if that applies in your situation, but what helped her change her perspective was witnessing how people treated me in discussions-

How often the topic gets treated as a joke, or dismissed because of strawman feminists, when she was used to giving my arguments at least a chance.
So yeah, maybe your bf needs to witness a different context?

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

I'm really not sure how that'd work, honestly. I guess it depends on how the BF is vocally not-feminist. I don't think it'd be fun (or even safe) to stay with a guy who thought it was okay to control my body or dismiss my wishes just because I'm a woman. Like... that's insulting something that's inherently a part of me, that I cannot change. If someone loved me, they wouldn't consider treating me like a second class citizen simply because I'm not a man.

Quite frankly, even milder forms of misogyny are so obnoxious that I wouldn't want to live with that on a daily basis. There are plenty of fish in the sea, no need to date an asshole.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

If he's vocal about it, then I'd say he's not worth the trouble. There's a difference between not identifying with a group and simply agreeing to disagree and being in your face about why what you strongly believe in is wrong. If he can't respect your beliefs enough to at least be civil about letting you have them in peace, then he doesn't respect you. Let's take ideologies out of this for a second. Imagine if he spoke vocally against anything else you cherished, and made you feel bad about caring about it? If he knows how much this means to you and chooses to act like this then he's an obnoxious child who wants to be the loudest voice in the room and will talk over you instead of actually listening and compromising with you.

There are plenty of fish in the sea. Don't waste any more of your time with this one.

Re: Advice Column

[(Anonymous)]

Doesn't the same go for OP?

Do you think she should shut the hell up about her feminism for the sake of the relationship?