[ SECRET POST #1582 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1582 ⌋


Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 05 pages, 125 secrets from Secret Submission Post #226.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 0 - hit/ship/spiration ], [ 0 - omgiknowthem ], [ 0 - take it to comments ], [ 0 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom.livejournal.com]

10. http://oi56.tinypic.com/mhdk6o.jpg

[miss-makiba.livejournal.com]

It's anime, and England/Romano/etc are shorter than the other characters. :\

(There might be a more complex reason, but I doubt it.)

this comment will probably not make sense if you have not seen ookami-san

[vethica.livejournal.com]

I was going to say "Hey now, tsunderes can be tall too," but then I remembered you're supposed to ship Ryouko Ookami with Ryoushi, not Ringo. So... I guess you're right. :P

[kuromitsu.livejournal.com]

He's shorter than other characters in the manga, too, sometimes quite dramatically...

[(Anonymous)]

Of course not. England is an abusive scum! Romano's simply worse.

[alliterations.livejournal.com]

An unfortunate aspect of fandom, I think.

I mean, it's fine for characters to display weakness, such as England canonically getting flustered easily, and the fact Romano has some serious self-esteem issues. But taking it to the point where they are made into pathetic, spineless, wibbling blobs with no backbone just so they can cling to whoever their love interest is, is just bad and lazy characterization.

On the other hand, turning them into "badasses" who go around kicking people's faces in is just as bad and lazy :/

[(Anonymous)]

Or ramped up into domestic abusers to make someone's rival ship look more "valid" or to justify someone's hate for them :/

This fandom is very unfortunate.

[kaasen.livejournal.com]

I agree with this on some levels. I feel like any feelings England is harboring for America is a sore spot, but it doesn't define him. Making him completely weak in the knees about America is really simplifying him and disregarding his relationships with other nations. Would someone who's put up with France all these years really fall apart at the seems over America?

For Romano, though, I think his insecurities are a big part of his character. He's not ONLY this weepy tsundere, but he's not very strong either.

[micromyni.livejournal.com]

Those aren't good fics. Don't read them. There are some fics where UK tops, written for and by people like me who want to see the short one take the lead. But you might have to dig for them.

UK/US recs for OP

[(Anonymous)]

There were some recs here with England topping America

http://usxuk.livejournal.com/1433306.html

I wouldn't recommend all of them but its a start.

[(Anonymous)]

I kinda hate Hetalia but ffffffffff their dynamic is so fascinating and this secret does not help. You are tempting me, OP.

[(Anonymous)]

ONE OF US, ONE OF US, ONE OF US!/SHOT

Seriously though, if you do join the fandom for this pairing, rest assured there is at least one anon who completely supports you even though you don't like the source material all that much.

[miezen.livejournal.com]

It's because in general, anime slash fandom wants to cling to the seme and uke tropes, and can't seem to comprehend how to keep a character written like he was in canon while writing him in a male/male pair. Because obviously his personality has to match up with the archetype for whichever position he takes. And England is physically smaller than America, who is drastically physically stronger than England. America also has a generally more dominant personality. So of course he's the seme. So England has to match the uke stereotype. Same with Romano and Spain, Finland and Sweden, etc. Pretty much every popular slash ship does this; the 'uke' character becomes a lovestruck, simpering fool who can't live without his 'seme' and goes into withdrawal if they're separated.

*Note, I'm not saying all slash fans do this. I know not all slash fans do this. I consider myself to be a slash fan and I don't do this. However, this is a major part of the slash fandom within anime as a whole, and it is something that's unique to anime slash fans. Or BL fans or yaoi fans or fujoshi or whatever you want to call them. So please don't give me a "we're not all like that" response or an "oh slashers in Western fandoms don't do that" or whatever other argument you want. Unless you want to try to deny to me that shoehorning characters into the seme and uke roles at the expense of compromising their characterization never happens.

[miss-makiba.livejournal.com]

I pretty much agree with you, and I've seen it happen in live action fandoms too, primarily with fans who move from yaoi to live action. I can't comprehend it myself except as an interpretation (sometimes unintentionally) of the worst stereotyping ever.

[kuromitsu.livejournal.com]

Except England is tsundere and was called such by Himaruya himself, and he has shown various traits that make it obvious that those fans are not simply coming up with aspects of his personality to make him fit their stereotypes. Are these traits often exaggerated? Yes, but they don't come entirely from fans' imagination.

That doesn't mean he must be a weepy little fluffball but then he's not always written that way. (Even though, as for being weepy, I think he cries more than any other character in the manga, except maybe for Latvia...)

[haro.livejournal.com]

Actually England IS very tsundere and blushy in canon. And he's sort of clingy as well.

I'm not saying people can't go overboard with it (and I agree that he's strong and prideful-- and I certainly would hate to see them as America's 'pet.' I see them as equals.), but uh, yeah. Pretty tired of people trying to turn England into something he isn't because of 'history.'

Same with Romano.

[kuromitsu.livejournal.com]

Pretty tired of people trying to turn England into something he isn't because of 'history.'

Exactly, this. People have preconceptions based on their own perception of history or whatver, and tend to gloss over the fact that ruthless pirate England? was the exact same character who got all weepy when some kid he's never met before called him "oniichan." And then they latch onto "BIG BAD RUTHLESS BRITISH EMPIRE OMG" and forget that from what we've seen he wasn't any different in his empire days.

If people want BIG BADASS RUTHLESS ENGLAND WHO DOMINATES THE SHIT OUT OF EVERYONE they're free to write him but don't pretend it's a better or a more accurate depiction of the character...

[(Anonymous)]

Oooooh a secret concerning Hetalia tsunderes.
...Is this a good time to ask for Spain/Romano fic?

[(Anonymous)]

oh, OP...

You're new, aren't you? Welcome to any fandom ever that has more than one male in it. You've got a character that tears rivals heads off with his bare hands and eats dunked kittens for breakfast? Somewhere there's a fan writing him as a weeping uke emo just waiting to get topped.

You've got a character that cross-dressed once and is shorter than the average male? He's reduced to lost muscle mass, tears in oversized blue eyes and taking it up the rear from the man that destroyed his entire life several times over.

You name it - badly written slash will and probably already has, slashed it. Characterization? Bah! We just want cute ukes and aggressive semes and who cares if it's in character or even realistic? Some fandoms you just have to wade through more of the bad stuff to find good stuff than others. I wish you luck though. There's a reason slash has such a cliche name in fandom.

disclaimer stating not ALL slash is badly written or sterotypical. Just that the bad tends to stand out more

[kuromitsu.livejournal.com]

"England is NOT a blushing little tsundere"

Crap! Quick, tell that to Himaruya, he's obviously doing his own character wrong!

It's kind of funny when people complain about canon not respecting their fantasies... Face it: he's tsundere, he tends to blush a lot - and canon so far has never mentioned "his sense of pride" (aside of his temper), and "the fading glory of his golden age" (lol?). He, however, has a tendency to be rather desperate as far as America is involved. ("Um, i-if you're so desperate for friends then I'll be your friend" "Call me like you used to do" "AMERICA YOU IDIOT~" etc etc...)

A person can be an ex-pirate and *GASP!* be lovestruck about someone. I know, I know, it's difficult to comprehend.

[niamy-tak.livejournal.com]

I agree with this secret. Ukefication really annoys me. At the same time, people are free to write what they want, I'll just avoid it.

[juandalyn.livejournal.com]

Disagreeing with some comments, I wouldn't say Himaruya actually "ukefies" England.

He blushes quickly, but Germany does as well.
He's a tsundere. Yes. But that doesn't actually make him a whiny little boy.

Tsundere, blushing England = yes, I'd like that. He's even cute like that.

But in the end... hey, it's fandom. It's not like you can actually make them stop it. So we have to get along with it. And in the end... it's just a manga.

[(Anonymous)]

Are you all really taking this shit seriously?

[(Anonymous)]

Why can't a former PRIVATEER get emotional around the person he loves? Plenty of people can be tough and resourceful when they're doing their jobs and then break down because someone they care about says something mean about them. He's a human, he has feelings.

And please would everone STFU about 'the glory' of whatever part of his past you're romanticising. He's a thriving modern nation, he doesn't need to be always defined by his past. What about his future?

[(Anonymous)]

LOL. Oh, dear god. Fanbrats like you just keep the fandom fresh.

You know why England is portrayed in fanon as a weepy, blushing, stereotypical Tsundere uke with childbearing hips in fanon? Because that's what he is in canon. Of course fans exaggerate these traits to ridiculous degrees, but people like OP insisting that 95% of UK's character isn't crying over America are just as bad.