[ SECRET POST #2016 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2016 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 065 secrets from Secret Submission Post #288.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

04. http://oi50.tinypic.com/jb4q4g.jpg

[(Anonymous)]

I appreciate anything that takes some of the blame off of teenage girls, since we seem to be considered at least semisatanic by most people, but... idk, I'm probably not going to put this well, I don't like twilight and I don't support the women pictured, but I hate that it's so common for enthusiastic women to be called "crazy bitches" when men can just run wild thoroughly unmocked.

I know it's good to criticize twilight because it's sexist, but there are plenty of sexist "guy" things, too, and let's be real, most people making fun of twilight aren't doing so because it contradicts their feminist ideals, they're doing it because they're 14-year-old boys who think sparkling is gay and are mad that their female classmates are more attracted to Robert Pattinson and Taylor Lautner than they are to them.

just... idk, I really don't want this comment to come off militant and angry or whatever because I completely see your point, but I'm wondering if all this anger about twilight moms isn't coming at least somewhere from internalized misogyny. I'm sure a lot of dads were freaking out about Black Ops last year and it was probably every bit as hilarious, but guys aren't "crazy bitches" when they're obsessed with things.

Again, I'm probably making 0 sense and I'm not trying to insult you or your potential project, I'm just rambling, ignore me....

[(Anonymous)]

but guys aren't "crazy bitches" when they're obsessed with things.

Well, there was that Philadelphia Phillies fan who shot and killed a man for wearing a St. Louis Cardinals jersey after a baseball game a few years ago (in 2009 or 2010). Sounds like "crazy bitch" material to me. Maybe it manifestly differently in different genders?

[wauwy]

uhhh is this really comparable? Like, men don't get that label until they take it to the extreme of shooting people?

[anonymouslyyours]

Pretty sure the original anonymous meant men don't get called "crazy bitches" even when they act like it. Not that only women act that way.

Also way to go to the most extreme example!

not op

[(Anonymous)]

the point was that guys can get away with being fanatics over something and acting like morons than women can, because then they're just "obsessive crazy bitches"

[(Anonymous)]

That is indeed crazy bitch material, and guys act like crazy bitches all the time, but my point was that they don't get called on it as much. I mean, I'm sure that guy got called out (seriously what the fuck), but Twilight fans don't have to murder people to be made fun of, and sports fans can get away with all 31 flavors of batshit cray and still be considered normal.

[wauwy]

I've been uncomfortable with the vitriol directed toward Twilight and its fans for a long time too, anon.

[(Anonymous)]

I beg to differ.

Men don't go unmocked for being enthusiastic about stuff. There's the geek stigma, and also let's be real, if a significant amount of guys went wild over Twilight they'd be "creepy pervs".

Yes, Twilight is sexist, but I see it criticised most for having bad writing, bad storytelling, and bad characters.

Part of it could be internalized misogyny but when a LOT of these Twilight "moms" over 30 are obsessed with the franchise, it is very often just self insert wishes.

[majorshipper]

*applauds* I agree. I don't like Twilight(or a myriad of other young adult-directed things), but I don't understand the irrationally violent bashing.

[(Anonymous)]

I've noticed more misogyny in anti-Twilight camps than in Twilight itself. Even from so-called feminists. They're ragging on about how sexist the books are and then going off about how teen girls are so moronic they need to be spoon-fed proper ideals, as though they saw a cape and thought it could make them fly. They treat all teenaged girls as brainless for liking a book. It's the same internalize misogyny you see from women saying "I don't hang out with other women, they're all so catty and superficial".

[(Anonymous)]

Men can be stalkers too.

[cleverthylacine]

There's a lot of internalised misogyny involved in Twilight hate--even the people who hate it for supposedly feminist reasons aren't willing to acknowledge that women and girls might not take Twilight any more seriously as a model for life than men and boys take James Bond books and movies!

When it comes to the Twilight moms, though, there's also a fuckload of internalised ageism. Middle-aged women are just supposed to disappear into the background and support their kids and husbands, especially if they're not career women. They're supposed to dress conservatively and be practical and not be sexy or romantic and if they're flashy at all people make fun of them. Teenage girls are allowed to be silly and obsessed in public, but if you're over 35, how dare you have fun and let go and enjoy something frivolous that much? People on F!S and FW are always making rude comments about middle aged women being "too old" for fandom (who do they think keeps fandom sites and businesses running?) and I can't count the stupid arguments in lolita fashion communities with people saying it's perfectly okay for 15-25 year olds to dress like Victorian children but once you hit 35 you're supposed to dress your age--fuck that noise.

I don't have kids so I am technically not a Twilight mom, but I'm over 40 and I wear lolita and I love Twilight and I have no intention of dropping lolita for Chico's or Twilight for Desperate Housewives. :)

I have no doubt that some of the older ladies in Twilight fandom have done inappropriate things because I have never been in a fandom where people--both young girls and older women--didn't do stupid, creepy or inappropriate things. But honestly, that's just how people work--some of them are inappropriate and creepy, but most of them are just trying to have fun.

[celestialchild]

most people making fun of twilight aren't doing so because it contradicts their feminist ideals, they're doing it because they're 14-year-old boys who think sparkling is gay and are mad that their female classmates are more attracted to Robert Pattinson and Taylor Lautner than they are to them.

Highlight, emphasize, underline, state multiple times.

I completely agree that there are many problematic elements in Twilight that deserve to be picked apart and analyzed, but the vast majority of people who criticize both it, and the fans, are doing so because of the sexist ideology that says girly things are "silly, ridiculous, and will never measure up". And neither will the fans.

If Twilight has demonstrated anything valuable, it is that women of ALL AGES enjoy having books that are about and directed at them, their interests and dreams and aspirations. (Not that these books cater to all women, of course). And this has made a great many people uncomfortable.

[(Anonymous)]

Men don't get mocked?! Sure, and that's why they are called "man-children" and told to grow up and basicly told nobody would want to be in a relationship with them for enjoying things some people consider to only be for children.

But sure, they don't get mocked. /sarkasm

[fuchsiascreams]

I get what you're saying and to be honest, I agree with you, but I find this a really weird forum to bring this up in.. like, Twilight? Really?

[(Anonymous)]

How did they "illegally" obtain call sheets?

[kallanda_lee]

Well, illegal would not be the right word. As someone who's been on sets: it's not that hard. People working on sets are just human too, and it's not like call sheets are always under lock and key. It would be hard to obtain if a friend of a crewmember was really a die-hard fan.

[kallanda_lee]

These people are moms? They all look in their early twenties....

[majorshipper]

Really? They seem more thirties to me, and mid-late at that.

[(Anonymous)]

This makes sense OP, if indeed it is true. I mean, they probably have better resources and more time if they are housewives.

[(Anonymous)]

there's being a fan

...and being a creepy cougar.

[veronica_rich]

Is that like being a fucking dirty old man?

/sweetly

[celestialchild]

Well I don't care that you should wish to write something examining the state of the Twilight fandom, and the inclusion of mothers in it, I highly suggest you take great pains to keep from falling into the pit-hole of pitting one group of women against another.

[dreamwidthcansuckmytits]

I think if you can portray it fairly, that would be a good ass read.