[ SECRET POST #2481 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2481 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.
[game of thrones]


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02.
[Star Trek, Sleepy Hollow, Elementary]


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03.


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04.
[Junjou Romantica]


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05.


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[ ----- SPOILERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]

























06. [SPOILERS for Percy Jackson]



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[ ----- TRIGGERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]


























07. [WARNING for suicide/self-harm]

[Slipknot]





















Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #354.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I don't see it as rape because Misaki himself later in the series says he was never really against it.
Therefore no, I disagree with the Rape is Love mentality entirely.

[(Anonymous)]

Well then I'm sure that's alright! I mean, the initial representation of the actual incident that left such a virulently negative impression on readers means nothing if the author can later cover their ass and just have the character say he liked it. That's something that's never present in a million yaoi and doesn't feed right into aforementioned trope at all.

[(Anonymous)]

>left such a virulently negative impression on readers
Speak for yourself. I've read enough japanese porn to tell when the author is showing them really against it and when they're only being tsundere.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh my god, you are such a stereotypical yaoi fan drinking the Kool Aid it physically pains me. Newsflash: the uke being "tsundere" is the no. 1 symptom of smoke and mirror covering sexual assault.

[(Anonymous)]

Says the stereotypical tumblrite spouting tumblr-like bullshit.

[(Anonymous)]

If that's what tumblr thinks then I gotta side with tumblr on this one. Yaoi has been plagued with gross tropes forever, and everyone knows it.

[(Anonymous)]

You find them gross all you like, it doesn't make them any "damaging" or "problematic" as if japanese porn manga (since I'm including hentai too), generally speaking, were ever supposed to be 100% realistic in the first place.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

How is romanticizing rape and sexual assualt not problematic in your opinion? Geniunely curious.

[(Anonymous)]

>Geniunely curious.

When people say this they're never genuinely curious.
Junjou isn't even about romanticizing rape and all that bullshit people come up with. The actual relationship between Misaki and Usami didn't start there, but at the end of volume 1 when Usami opened up for the first time. It grew from there, and it's a very beautiful relationship. I think what happened at the beginning of the volume was simply already forgiven by Misaki by the time Usagi apologized, and I respect Misaki's decision.

As for actual romanticizing rape and sexual assualt? I can name only very few series that do that, like Okane ga nai, and while I really don't like that series I'm not so dumb not to understand that it's just a piece of japanese fiction. You may have noticed that for all the demonizing yaoi gets, western authors have kept their own tropes, and tsundere in the bed either don't appear or are very different from their japanese counterparts. Maybe because most people have common sense and realized they were reading a piece of japanese fiction too. That's why I always roll my eyes when people say "problematic" like they're soccer moms trying to ban videogames.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, you certainly disagree with most of the people in this thread about what Junjou does or does not do. I, on the other hand, find the depiction of forgiveness in itself quite offensive, as if the offender "opening up" and turning out to be a pure, beautiful soul suddenly makes the ugliness of past action go away. The character isn't a real person, his "decision" is just a reflection of the author's belief.

So because western media also has problems, we should let yaoi off the hook? Why not criticize both, if there are flaws all around? Why this insistence on Japanese fiction being just fiction, as if it's special somehow? Fiction is fiction; if it has issues, people will point it out. If you don't think romanticizing sexual assault and excusing it is problematic, that's your call, but I will never be on the same page.

[(Anonymous)]

Because you can't seem to see that when people read these things, they don't just say, "Oh this is rape fantasy, I know it's gross but it isn't real". They come in all, well, like you: "This isn't rape, it's romantic and ~tsundere~. He actually liked it, you see."

da

[(Anonymous)]

I've never read the canon myself, but if it's true that the character himself says it wasn't rape, then it isn't rape. That's not the reader making assumptions or justifying it, that's the character themselves coming out and stating that it was not in fact rape.

Re: da

[(Anonymous)]

It doesn't work because, unlike real life, the readers have already been invited to witness the incident and draw their conclusion. The depiction gave them the clear impression that this is sexual assault, so having the character deny it after the fact isn't convincing.

[(Anonymous)]

In Misaki's case, yes, that's exactly it.
But I'm still able to say that it's still a fantasy and most people are not Misaki, nor act or think the way he does. I don't mean it in a bad way either, since I admire how kind-hearted and selfless he is, but hey - he's still an anime character.

[(Anonymous)]

This is really gross. It's a really damaging trope for a fucking reason, but get down with your bad self.

[(Anonymous)]

How is it damaging? Certainly you are able to tell the difference between reality and fiction?

[(Anonymous)]

Fiction that romanticizes sexual violence is criticized all the time.

[(Anonymous)]

So are videogames that let you shoot people. And critics of both are equally thought as idiots who can't tell the difference between what is real and what isn't.
And I don't even see Junjou as romanticizing sexual violence.

DA

[(Anonymous)]

I hate when people try and pull in FPS violent games with defending sexual violence in games. You see it all the time trying to derail or defend sexism and sexual violence and I'm just tired of it.

Re: DA

[(Anonymous)]

That's because you don't want to admit there's no difference between the two and what works for one argument works for the other as well.

[(Anonymous)]

Right, because the violence in video games that serves to give people adrenaline highs are so realistic and true to what that kind of violence would be like in life. But how do you "de-real" sexual assault? Why would you derive a high from even a simulation of it?

da

[(Anonymous)]

you do realize that rape fantasy is one of the most common sexual fantasies that women have, right?

[(Anonymous)]

>But how do you "de-real" sexual assault?
You're seriously asking this while talking about fiction?

[(Anonymous)]

Now I'm pretty sure you're a troll, which is kinda sad because aside from the rape I legitimately enjoyed JJR

[(Anonymous)]

"Aside from the rape" isn't something that works for everyone. We all draw the line somewhere, just because yours doesn't align with mine hardly makes me a troll.