[ SECRET POST #2181 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2181 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 100 secrets from Secret Submission Post #312.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 1 2 (again) - repeat ], [ 4 - trolls ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

10. http://i.imgur.com/2OQ2C.jpg

[cherrycoloured.livejournal.com]

To each their own. If you don't want to watch Classic Who, don't. People in the fandom get annoyed by fans who claim to know everything but only know New Who, but as long as you don't do that, or don't get involved in Classic v. New fights, I don't think it'll be an issue. A lot of people in the fandom right now only like New Who. I think Classic Who is great, but it's really different that New Who and while I personally recommend watching one story just to see what it's like, if you don't want to, don't. Do what makes you happy, and fuck anyone who tells you that you aren't a real fan :)

[(Anonymous)]

Is it weird that I get slightly depressed every time I see a secret paint Nine as the "meh" Doctor? He had a much more uplifting character arc than Ten, and I hate how he always gets glazed over.

[(Anonymous)]

Not at all! Although some of Ten's storylines are my favorite, overall Nine is my favorite doctor. I love his personality, reactions, and his relationship to Rose a lot. Super excited about the fact he might come back for the 50th anniversary!

[intrigueing]

I always tell people I don't play favorites with the Doctor, but if I'm honest with myself, Nine is my favorite. He was so traumatized and fragile and in pain and yet so hopeful and cautiously optimistic in his pain in that weird gruff way of his, like he was trying to seem tougher than he really was to pre-emptively protect himself from disappointment, and trying to force himself to adopt all the typical coping mechanisms of miserable lonely old soldiers, but just being really fucking terrible at it because he was essentially such a deceptively soft-hearted guy who enjoyed being happy so much, despite being a tad batshit insane. And he was the incarnation I was watching when I fell in love with the Doctor in general.

And he has the best smile ever.

[taotrooper]

Nope. I couldn't stand Ten, and while I like Eleven a lot I'm not digging his stories as much recently (LOL Moffat). So from all the nu!Doctors, I think Nine is the most balanced and likable of the three.

[fauxkaren]

You definitely don't need to watch Classic Who.

I've seen a decent amount and I don't feel like it was necessary or enriching at all. Plus, idk. It was made in the 60s and 70s and the kind of TV Making and Story Telling they were doing back then doesn't really translate all that well to an audience used to 21st century style TV Making and Story Telling.

Also, I feel you on not loving TOS. lol. I grew up on Voyager and TNG so those are "my" Star Trek series. And I did love the re-boot movie. But I am so meh on TOS.

[(Anonymous)]

I totally agree that it doesn't make someone less of a fan to not want to watch Old Who, but it's disheartening to see someone mention seeing quite a bit of it and not finding it enriching at all. :(

I can understand finding the look or style of it off-putting (as you said, compared to what TV viewers have come to expect) but there was some fantastic story-telling in Old Who. I think there are a plethora of episodes that - if remade to today's television standards - would stand up too, or outshine most of the new stuff.

But I guess if you can't get past the way it looks, then it's really hard to see beyond that.

[silverr]

Yeah, New Who is to Classic Who a lot like, say, Deep Space Nine was to TOS.

All have good stories and acting, but I think that whether you'll like the older stuff depends partly on your tolerance for cheesy sets, costumes and SFX, and partly on your ability to recognize how the older shows fit into the culture of their times (especially on matters of gender, sexuality, and race).

(And this viewpoint of mine is probably because I grew up watching TOS and Classic Who.)

[(Anonymous)]

.....it also depends on your ability to enjoy Classic!Who without having to overthink and apply all these SJW PC labels / "metanarrative" garbage onto it....

[(Anonymous)]

If you don't want to watch Classic Who, then don't. Like TOS, it's an older show and has a healthy dose of the retro sci-fi cheese as a result. It's great if you're into that sort of thing or if it doesn't bother you, but some people just can't get into that. Doesn't make you a bad fan.

[(Anonymous)]

I think knowing Classic Who is useful if you want to be super nerdy and understand all the backgrounds of the different aliens etc. It really depends on how into it you are.

I'm old enough to have hidden behind the sofa to Tom Baker's doctor, I still get a little scared thinking back to some of those episodes. Elisabeth Sladen was my favourite companion. So if I watch it now it's just nostalgia, I'm not watching thinking about the production values or how different telly was in the 70s. Well except in a good way as it reminds me how much more innocent we were as people then and how young we were as children, we weren't sophisticated and didn't expect much from things, so believed a monster made from bubble wrap.

Nine is my favourite of the modern doctors, but Tom Baker was my doctor.

[ryttu3k]

S'all good, OP :) The modern show feels very different to some of the older stuff, although there's a healthy dose of darkness in Seven's era once he gets past the clowning (Ace's seasons > Mel's season). Everyone is going to have different stuff that pings them, and if the modern stuff pings you more, more power to you!

(As a side note, I also disliked TOS. The first series I saw was TNG, then Voyager, so when Sci Fi started showing TOS, I just... could not get into it. Way too cheesy, way too... much of a product of its time, I guess. And Kirk was obnoxious. But they've just finished their TOS run and have started on Enterprise, which is like the ultimate in mixed reviews, so we'll see how that goes!)

[(Anonymous)]

Honestly I don't ever look down on someone who started with New Who being unable to get into Old Who. Original Doctor Who was made at a different time, it's got a different look and feel to it and that can be jarring compared to what you're used to. Some of it is very silly and visually it's ... well, the production values aren't always the best. I always like to encourage people to give it a try, because I do think some of the best story telling took place with earlier regenerations. But - at the same time, sometimes people just can't get into it, and that's understandable.

I've seen at least several episodes of each Doctor (not nearly as much of the First, Second or Third as I'd like, but the majority of Four onward) - and I love it all because it's WHO! So as a Whovian, I'm always glad when more people start watching, no matter which Doctor they start with.

Though, I will admit to getting a bit frustrated when people talk about certain topics and scenes in New Who as if they're the 'be all, end all' of that particular thing as it relates to the Doctor. For example - one thing that springs immediately to mind is Donna. I've seen people say that what happened to her was just the worst thing for a companion evar! And I do think it was awful. But then I want to respond with 'But that's not the first time a companion has been slotted back into their life with no memory of the Doctor' - I mean, Jamie!

[intrigueing]

If people have been giving you shit about not being a true fan for not watching Classic Who, tell them to stuff it. They just want something to feel superior about. And New Who is quite a different animal from Classic Who in many ways, and a lot of material in Classic Who doesn't have any essential relevance to New Who because so much stuff has changed in-universe during the gap.

On the other hand, if you're gonna be participating in fandom and doing meta and analysis and stuff, I'd be careful about trying to make great sweeping generalizations and definitive statements (about, say, companion relationships, or regeneration, that kind of thing), since you kinda have only been exposed to a section of the canon (and a quite unique section when it comes to the relevant external and characterization factors -- Time War and all), so just be aware of the gap in your knowledge in order to not look stupid.

Also, the Classic Who Doctors and Companions are pretty fucking awesome characters, even if the stories are told very differently. So if your interest ever does perk up, you can cherry-pick a few of the best serials just for curiosity's sake.

[cloud_riven]

I thought this was actually a popular opinion.

ngl though, I can't watch me most of the old stuff without getting bored stiff unless it gives me genuine laffs.

[citrinesunset]

I think this is okay! There's a lot of Old Who to watch, anyway. It's not a minor undertaking to watch it all.

As long as you don't act like the ultimate Doctor Who expert or something, I think you're fine. I've seen some Old Who, but not a lot.

[(Anonymous)]

I madly adore Classic Who (particularly the Third and Seventh Doctor eras), but Classic is a very different style and feel, and sometimes that's just not people's thing. The closest I can think of to Ten's feel was maybe Five, possibly Six (Trial of a Timelord feels a lot like some of Ten's storylines), but even then they're still a different beast to Nu!Who.

So long as you're not knocking Classic on its own merits, I really don't see a problem. If it's not your thing, it's not your thing, and Nu!Who was specifically designed to largely stand alone, so you don't really need to watch Classic if you don't want to. *shrugs* Watch the things you want to watch, yes?

[(Anonymous)]

Classic Who is definitely not for everyone. I wanted to like it. I tried to like. I even told everyone around me that I liked it in the hopes it would magically be true. I didn't like it.

[(Anonymous)]

I relish the tragic, bittersweet endings.

You know, I'm one of the last people who anyone would call a Moffat fan and I hate most of the stuff under his tenure, but I gotta admit I loved "The Big Bang" to hundreds of itty bitty pieces because for the first time in five years, I got an ending that didn't make me cry, rage, or do both at the same time. I mean, there was a negative body count. How awesome was that, just for a change?

[(Anonymous)]

Eh, won't hurt to check out some of the better serials from Old Who. You don't have to watch it all, but some of the old stuff is a lot of fun, and some of it's epic, and some of it's so bad you have to watch it because the sets are cardboard and the costumes are stupid and the acting is hilarious.

[(Anonymous)]

The characterization in Classic Who is definitely very different in style, but if you ever do get the itch to see some of it, you won't be disappointed to have the patience and perspective to watch enough of it. It's slow going, definitely not a show that needs to distill a full character arc into thirteen episodes, but the characterization is great all the same once you receive it.

Like, the First Doctor's character arc is a thing of absolute beauty - probably the most wonderful and "feels just right" development that any of the Doctors have had.

(However, if you don't like it, don't force yourself to -- that would just be unpleasant and defeats the point of watching it, and not watching it doesn't make you less of a fan. Just don't hold back on watching it if you ever do feel the urge.)

[(Anonymous)]

You certainly don't have to watch it, but the thing about Classic Who is that it ran for ~25 years and lots of different people were involved, so it's highly variable. For example, the 80s stuff feels very different from the early 70s stuff, which feels very different from the 60s stuff. If you're up to it, it can't hurt to poke around in it a bit and see if there's anything you like. You certainly don't have to watch an entire doctor or an entire season, but there are some episodes that are a lot of fun.

[tenlittlebullets]

*facehands* "I love the guilt, the rage, the shame, the loneliness" is just about the pithiest possible summary of my overinvestment in Ten (and to a lesser extent Nine and Eleven). RTD Who is like feelings heroin.

However! I am also a huge fan of the Classic Who I've seen, albeit in a rather more laid-back way. I'd recommend at least giving it a try; it doesn't push the same buttons for me that New Who does, but a lot of the elements that I already liked as a secondary part of some New Who episodes are much more central to my enjoyment of Classic Who, if that makes sense. For example, I tend to be fond of the "base under siege" style episodes in the new series, independent of the characterization and/or feelings heroin going on, because they're more likely to be based around really cool concepts--The Impossible Planet/The Satan Pit, 42, Waters of Mars, The Rebel Flesh/The Almost People, plus stuff like Midnight and The God Complex. And in Classic Who, okay fine, the angst porn is mostly gone, but the concept porn is incredible and usually it's what drives the serial. (As a sillier example, possibly my favorite subset of "angst porn" is "Ten getting smacked around and leered at by the Master," which Classic Who does even more deliciously.)

Anyway, if you're ever curious about how Classic Who does "dark," I second the recommendation for Seven and Ace (particularly their last season--zomg Curse of Fenric), and would also add Genesis of the Daleks and maybe The Keeper of Traken/Logopolis/Castrovalva. The latter is mostly personal preference, but said preference somehow feels related to my love for Ten, and also End of Time is totally Logopolis redux. ;)

[diabolicalfiend]

Seven's latter era was dark and anything Big Finish is guaranteed to be all the things new Who is along with you're not able to see the monster of the week so you're left flailing when SHIT GOES DOWN.

It also might give you a weapon against some Classic fans who get on your case because it's more obscure than the telly show.

(Not that I approve of fans warring but snobs really need putting in their place.)