[ SECRET POST #2314 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2314 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 096 secrets from Secret Submission Post #331.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

04. http://i41.tinypic.com/t4zadv.jpg

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think it's a cardinal sin, I just kinda think "why?" if the person has been watching his stuff for a long time.

I mean, don't get me wrong, I loved his stuff at first too, until I had been exposed to it long enough to actually process it. And no, it wasn't because of the sexism or female characters.

Agreed

[(Anonymous)]

Also female, and I think most of the criticisms against him are really reaching. Not to mention most of the so-called examples of him being anti-women are either out of context or willfully misquoted. I'd like to think it is just the usual Dr Who fans bitching about the showrunner dujour, or the butthurt RTD/Rose fans, but I have a horrible feeling he is the target of some SJW group which will never give up regardless how dumb they are. Because that is how SJW groups work. Also, criticism is easier than real comment on Tumblr. You can have "Lol Moffat-Misogyny" on Tumblr and it'll be given kudos and called a real statement.

Re: Agreed

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah... no.

Re: Agreed

[(Anonymous)]

Blabla "everything is shit on tumblr"

[(Anonymous)]

eh my dislike of Moffat has nothing to do with his writing of women. i think he's a bit... one-dimensional at times with them (they worship the doctor! ... well, there we go then!) but it's not like that's ALL he does. i just... dislike him. he's so full of himself and not at all open to criticism and that's a sign of a bad writer. even if i LIKED a writer if i heard them say they refused critique altogether i'd probably look down on them - creatively speaking people should be open to growing and he seems to think he's the God of Doctor Who who can Do No Wrong and that's why i dislike him. he's flawed. he should not be the end-all-be-all of The Doctor.

[(Anonymous)]

I've never noticed any sexism in his writing but that's probably because I'm bored to tears with all but two or three episodes since he took over. But he wrote some episodes in the RTD era that were fantastic. I realized a while ago that I prefer him as a writer working for someone else.

[intrigueing]

My dislike of Moffat has very little to do with his sexism, I'm embarrassed to say. For me, that's just the icing on the cake. *shrugs* I actually liked him a lot at first, but the most vaguely broad reason I have for disliking his writing is that it feels cold and hard and antiseptic to me. That's not remotely a universal "if you like this it's a cardinal sin" reason.

I don't think it's a cardinal sin though? His stories are fun and funny and inventive and have a lot of things I can see people liking. If that's your thing, hey, go for it and enjoy it. Nothing wrong with seeing the good in things. Just don't write long whiny analyses about how nothing he writes can even be construed as problematic, and you're fine.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, good. You SHOULD feel bad for liking that crap.

[(Anonymous)]

Can I ask why? I like some of his episodes and the things he's done, but it seems like I like them more in spite of his predilections and tropes than because of them.

[(Anonymous)]

Have you read some of the more in-depth and analytical criticisms of his writing or the sexism in his writing? I'm not saying that you won't still like him afterwards - no writer is perfect and it's hard to find a single piece of fiction that isn't slightly problematic, since we live in a problematic society and writers reflect society - but it might make you see things you didn't notice before. Some of them are bullshit paranoia, but some are really quite good.

[akashasheiress]

Whenever someone says this I feel like they must be on different internets than me, because I always felt like a traitor for not loving him.

[fauxkaren]

He has plenty of fans, so you're not alone.

But personally, aside from my issues with how he writes women, I just don't find him a very interesting writer. He relies on the same tropes over and over and I don't really care for the tropes he seems to love (fucking time loops). He puts a lot of emphasis on ~mystery~ and the reveal is never proportionately satisfying to the built up. His snappy dialogue generally serves as a wallpaper that is attempting to cover up the crumbling walls that are his plots.

I just... yeah.

Not a fan of his writing and never have been and it's not just because of how he writes women.

[philstar22]

I think that a lot of his writing is sexist, but I still like it in spite of that. It is okay to like problematic things. It is also okay to have differing opinions on what is problematic.

It doesn't bother me when people don't like him. That I get. I think what annoys me is when fans point out his sexism but ignore how equally problematic the show was under Davies. There is a lot of sexism (and other isms) in New Who. It is still really awesome, though.

[elephantinegrace]

I dislike his writing because of its sexism and repetition, but it's polished enough that I'll still watch Doctor Who. I just won't re-watch it over and over like I did other episodes, because his storylines are best left without going back and realizing just how stupid most of it is.

[(Anonymous)]

Eh his writing can be sexist and he does come off as a dick in most of the interviews I've seen/read with him but I don't see how that makes him different from most television writers + show-runners today. And lbr RTD's writing could also be sexist.

[redfiona99]

Don't worry Anon, you can come watch his stuff with me.

[vongroovy]

He has a lot of fans, so you're not alone! I wish I could like him more.

While his sexism does have some bearing on my dislike of him, my biggest problem is that I just find his writing really weak. In the past he's written some things that I thought were excellent and that I really connected with, but I find everything he's done lately a bit tired and relying too heavily on the same tropes and lacking an emotional connection. Most of it just seems like really bad storytelling. I think he has so much more potential and talent than his recent writing would suggest, and it's disappointing when his writing just falls flat for me.

[sarnath]

Yeah, it's funny, because often when I see people talking about Moffat's writing I wonder what the hell they've been watching. (Of course, sometimes they follow up by saying they haven't actually watched, but turned the television off/walked away/read it somewhere/heard it from a guy at the pub.)

Not to say there is no sexism anywhere in his writing, of course; I don't think there is any media that's completely without it.

Most of all I think he writes a great variety of women, and women that feel like they are human first.

I think a lot of people react to plotlines that are described in a very reductive way, without looking at how they're actually played out. Amy's being captured and having to give birth in a research facility in the care of The Silence may sound as if removing her agency and making her nothing but a walking womb, but that's not what happened in the execution. I've also seen it described as "forced pregnancy", which wasn't the case at all.

I actually loved RTD's Who too, I just happen to love Moffat's even more. But I understand people not liking his writing; someone upthread described him as "cold" and similar, and while it doesn't feel that way to me, I can see where they come from. His Doctor is more alien and inhuman, his romance expressed very differently from RTD's (and in a way that's more moving to me, actually!), and focuses more on mysteries and playing around with time (both of which I love).

RTD was more prone to have themes like faith, loss, and a more personal love as the focus of his series', and used time travel to go places in different eras and places rather than using time itself as a plot point. He used grand, emotional gestures and focused on the Doctor's humanity (so to speak) rather than the alienness. He also gave more weight to romance; Moffat writes falling for the Doctor more as a side effect of meeting him, more of a crush/admiration thing than really falling in love. Even with River, there's a distance (which she also seems perfectly aware of; her story is really tragic in more ways than one, and I've actually been moved to tears by a stray sentence from her).

Moffat is in many ways very understated compared to RTD, but he also likes to cram a lot into his episodes. Sometimes too much; the relationship problems Amy and Rory had and the quick way they cleared them up in the beginning of this series was very wtf.

I will be the one to say it.

[(Anonymous)]

It's not a sin to have bad taste OP.

[(Anonymous)]

He seems to be quite the douchebag.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, aren't you special.

But seriously, plenty of people love his work, so you're in good company. I'm just continually disappointed by his brand of sexism in my favourite show (yeah me and it go way back). It's always had sexism, but Moffat's is so in your face for me. And Press Gang was one of my favourite shows when I was little :( So I have no agenda, like most people wanting to enjoy Doctor Who, we just can't help being smacked in the face with what we see as disappointing genderisms. Plus I don't really like his scripts beyond his witticisms :'(

[(Anonymous)]

I have problems with some of his writing. But taken as a whole I still enjoy the Moffat era far more than the RTD era. I still adore River, and the Doctor/River ship, even though I cringed at how it all was handled in Season Six. I love Amy and Rory. I like Clara. I love Eleven. Compare that to RTD's era where I'm not that fond of either Rose or Martha, and I am just over Ten and his melodrama. (Nine was fun, but didn't stick around long enough). I did love Donna, and will never really get over what they did to her. :(

I know I'm in the minority on this. And I'm not trying to argue that some of his stuff isn't sexist. I hated what he did with River in S6, and even though I ship them I hated their wedding - that was a horrible way to handle that. But....I still love his characters more than RTD's(Donna excepted) in spite of the problematic writing. Does that make sense? Maybe? A little? I don't know.

I wonder where all the Moffat stan anons were before this secret

[(Anonymous)]

Because you've been rather quiet before this secret popped up. Where were you guys? I thought FS was a bastion of Moffat-hate! Or are you all the secret-maker?

[(Anonymous)]

I absolutely adore Moffat's writing. I'm female too. I find it offensive when other people tell me I shouldn't because he's *insert tired insult here*.