[ SECRET POST #2002 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2002 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 066 secrets from Secret Submission Post #286.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 2 - text comments ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

12. http://i.imgur.com/QIJjC.png

[loracarol]

Isn't that the point of movie!Sophie's character, though? That she doesn't think highly of herself, therefor being cursed means little, because the person who is cursed (herself) means little to her? That's why she says things like "well, my clothes finally suit me now", because she really doesn't see herself as mattering. Also, on why Howl couldn't actually be Howl in the very beginning, she says it's because Howl only eats the heart of "beautiful girls", i.e. not her. She just doesn't see herself as important, I thought that was just why she accepted it. And even then you can see that she doesn't completely accept it, look at the meal that she eats with Markl and Howl that first morning, when she gets angry, and tries to explain the curse, but can't.

And, honestly, I thought Princess Mononoke was actually really uplifting. Fatalistic? How? The lepers getting a second chance, instead of just being left alone to die? The ex-prostitutes being given a chance to have a respectable job, with a boss who respects them? And, tbh, I didn't get that the couple was "abusive", but that they had a joking relationship that worked for them. Did I miss something?

[habilelapin]

Anon, it's alright to not like something. Personally, I love all the Studio Ghibli movies, and even own most of them. (Thank you Disney!) I find them very beautiful, and the characters compelling. I especially like that Ghibli seems to focus on a variety of female protagonists.

That doesn't mean you have to like them though. Anyone who can't respect different tastes in something as inconsequential as fandom is pretty immature, in my opinion.

[(Anonymous)]

Could you perhaps explain where you got the 'fatalistic' interpretation of Princess Mononoke from?

As the commenter above said, Princess Mononoke is actually about new beginnings, new chances; you're saying you haven't finished watching the film. May I suggest you do? The ending is not fatalistic at all.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not a fan of Ghibli movies in general either. They are certainly visually beautiful, but the writing is almost always awful (not the basic plots or ideas, just the way they are handled) and I just can't enjoy them as anything more than meaningless eye candy.

Also, if those movies bothered you: don't watch Ponyo. Just. Don't watch Ponyo. I actually like Howl's Moving Castle and Princess Mononoke but I HATED Ponyo.

[(Anonymous)]

Same, the only one I liked out of all the ones I have watched is Princess Mononoke, and not even that much.

[(Anonymous)]

You just don't like the films. That's okay. I think, though, that you and others might find the films more enjoyable if you let go of your storytelling expectations -- the storytelling structure I find to be pretty "Japanese" in a way. Or at least, they don't follow the typical story structure you find in stories from England/North America. Also, Miyazaki definitely has an anti-war, pro-environmentalism agenda, which I happen to like quite a bit, actually, but it may come across as preachy to others.

I second the above comments, though, about Mononoke-hime. It's about new chances, and I don't think the relationship you're talking about is abusive... but you can read what you like into it.

[natural_blue_26.livejournal.com]

...Is it bad that part of me wonders if this is at least partially a more specific response to the "All Disney movies suck because Studio Ghibli movies are the most awesome EVER" secret that was around a few weeks ago?

As for Sophie at least (haven't seen the others), it seemed to me that we were supposed to think Sophie kind of had a history of, if not specifically letting things happen to her, not fighting them kicking and screaming (cue the soldiers on the way to see her sister before Howl showed up) going into the curse being put on her. Having the appearance of an older woman who was past the part of her life when society expected her to conform quite as much to their behavioral expectations of her seemed to me to be very freeing for Sophie to act out against what was happening to her (or Madame Suliman on Howl's behalf) in ways she wouldn't have before.

Or at least that was what I got out of it. *shrug*

[azi]

I find Ghibli movies kind of hit and miss. The animation is usually breathtaking, but the storytelling is ... stilted. With the exception of Princess Mononoke, Howl's Moving Castle and Spirited Away, I find them devoid of a Beginning-Middle-End formula. I don't know why.

As for the fatalism of Princess Mononoke, I can only assume you're talking about the 'gods' standpoint on the subject of their impending demise. In another light, though, I love that it's a film that somehow portrays both sides of the conflict somewhat sympathetically.

[(Anonymous)]

I wasn't really into Princess Mononoke, too OP. My favorites are My Neighbor Totoro and The Cat Returns. I prefer the more lighthearted Ghibli movies.

[wauwy]

To be honest, I find Miyazaki's later stuff to be far less entertaining than his earlier works. Like, they might be more beautiful and weird and arty and less pulpy, but they don't speak to me or move me the same way. And I don't buy that it's because of his being a more "Japanese" aesthetic as he got older, just more of an artiste, complex one, and that's fine. "Laputa," and "Totoro," both made in the 80's, and both with more conventional narratives and aesthetics, are still his two most beloved movies in Japan. So.

Anyway, my personal favorite movie of his is his first, Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind, which is a straight-up post-apocalyptic fantasy. I love everything about it and could write treatises as to why. On the list as well is Laputa Castle in the Sky, which is also an adventure, and Kiki's Delivery Service, which is just delightful and beautiful. Watch all of them in the original Japanese subtitles except for Kiki, because of Phil Hartman.

I've been a Miyazaki fan since 1994 and I didn't really like Spirited Away all that much, tbh. Howl's Moving Castle was beautiful but again, a complicated movie that is more cerebral than anything else, imo. Complicated emotions, kind of boring and weird. I loved Princess Mononoke but that is also because I had a huge crush on Billy Crudup and Ashitaka.

Watch "Castle in the Sky." It strikes a good balance between his delightful feel-good stuff like Kiki and Totoro and his adventure stuff like Nausicaa and Mononoke.

[sochitelya]

Slightly off-topic, but I first watched PM when I was 13-ish, alone with a guy from another high school who had been my French class penpal. Now I can't help but associate it with the nervous terror of wondering if he was going to (gasp!) put his arm around me or something.

He didn't, lol. Now I don't even remember his name. /csb

[childings.livejournal.com]

I agree with you on all of those movies being crap (except I kind of enjoyed Chihiro's Journey/Spirited Away) for basically the same reasons you pointed out, but Miyazaki has changed so much as a director over his 40 year career, that it's kind of weird to judge him based on those most recent movies. In any case, my advice would be to

WATCH FUTURE BOY CONAN

Miyazaki was always a better tv director than a film director. As far as his films go though, I would say his best are probably Laputa and Totoro -- Nausicaa was okay but ended so abruptly (but I think he may not have been done with the manga at the time the film came out, I can't remember, in any case it really condensed the manga). I just find it really weird that you would judge him on the latest films to come out considering he seems to be less and less involved with Studio Ghibli all the time (he didn't even direct the latest Ghibli film)

[cherrycoloured.livejournal.com]

I was kind of "meh" on Mononoke as well, as I prefer his more cheerful stuff. Kiki's Delivery Service is my favorite Miyazaki film! If you enjoy Spirited Away (I've never heard it called Chihiro's Journey before, so I'm kind of amused by that), you will like that one and Castle in the Sky, most likely.

[kathkin]

I really hate the film version of Howl's Moving Castle, if that helps. I mean not for any of the reasons you said but still. It just grates and I can't stand it. *ahahaha bitter book fan*

[majesdane]

Tbh Kiki's Delivery Service and Princess Mononoke are pretty much the only Miyazaki movies I like. Spirited Away is okay, I don't mind it, but it's not my favorite. But everything is subjective, so ...

[velvet_mace]

I think Sophie enjoyed her curse. It allowed her to walk away from the job she wasn't enjoying and go out and have adventures. As an old woman no one was wooing her or pressuring her to date, people gave her some "old person" respect, and she was allowed to be cantankerous and eccentric and do what she liked.

[ooh_mrdarcy]

I watch for the superb animation and the fantastic, unique atmosphere each movie has going on. And the flying. The flying is always the best part.
And to me all the movies seem like real labors of love, above anything else.

They are very quirky, and I can easily see why someone wouldn't find them as charming as I do. You don't have to force yourself to like them.

[streetcake]

I liked the fact that Sophie stayed calm in that situation. I know I would freak out, but I think it was cute that she accepted and tried to make it work.

I like Ghibli movies, and my favorite since I was a kid has always been Totoro. It's fine if you don't like them though; it's no worse than someone not liking Disney films or some other studio's films. Hype doesn't mean anything when it comes to personal taste.

[brooms]

just taking this opportunity to say ppl should check out howl's moving castle the book

it's completely different from the movie, and i really do mean completely.

and i like both. for different reasons.

[darkmanifest]

In the Howl's Moving Castle book, it's made more explicit that Sophie was numb with shock for awhile until she came to a full realization of what had happened to her. The movie wasn't as clear about that as it could have been (considering it managed to condense and convey Sophie's eventual rage and upset just fine). But as much as I flipping adore the movie, I can see what people might dislike about it.

Princess Mononoke didn't make as much of an impression on me (enjoyed it, it was kinda preachy and dubious in its resolution), but if you haven't seen Kiki's Delivery Service, I suggest you give it a shot. It's a very sweet and straightfoward story in comparison to the other two.

[vethica]

Is Spirited Away called Chihiro's Journey somewhere else (like Arrietty vs. The Secret World of Arrietty), or did OP just get the name wrong? :P

[(Anonymous)]

I do like them well enough, but Howl's Moving Castle and Princess Mononoke aren't really my favourite Ghibli films. Out of Miyazaki films, my favourites are Porco Rosso and Laputa: Castle in the Sky. As for Ghibli films by other directors, I thought Grave of the Fireflies (though warning: it is devastatingly sad and not a children's film!) and Only Yesterday were pretty wonderful.

What I really like about Ghibli films is the certain bittersweetness they have, wonderfully written and well-rounded young female characters and (what seems to me) a rather realistic way of handling the pain and beauty of growing up. (But then, I'm from Northern Europe, and I've grown up with bittersweet children's literature, so there's probably some nostalgia in my enjoyment.)

[maverickz3r0]

I couldn't stand Spirited Away or Kiki's Delivery Service, but I loved Princess Mononoke. I'm not sure how they're any of them immune to not being liked. Not liking popular stuff doesn't mean you have bad taste.

[(Anonymous)]

Ghibli movies just might not be your cup of tea. Miyazaki's type of storytelling isn't for everyone. They're much more subtle in a lot of ways than Western media is (like when it comes to characters and such), and just don't appeal to everyone.