[ SECRET POST #4044 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #4044 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 30 secrets from Secret Submission Post #579.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

03. https://i.imgur.com/nDyZ0Wk.png

[(Anonymous)]

Most shows? Not really.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, this. Not even anywhere close.

[(Anonymous)]

I know, right? That's just not a reflection of reality and I find it hard to take anyone seriously who makes that claim.

[digitalghosts]

Plus not everyone would like all the shows In an ideal world you'd have major gay romance in well written and popular series withing its genre. At the same time another one in this group would have strong het romance, another one would be an ensemble and so on. We do have such but
... not many, in addition it usually is every two seasons and a minor plot.

I mainly watch sci-fi or drama with only one comedy mixed in. Someone mentioned The Fosters which I shall use for example as this is not my kind of show at all. Same as The Real (insert last name, forgot) - would never gotten into it regardless of a gay character. Seen Orphan Black and that I liked, also carried a torch for Torchwood long enough despite cheesyness.

[saturnofthemoon]

I....don't consider Jessica Jones to be a positive representation of queer characters.

[(Anonymous)]

Can I ask why? I never made it through the whole series (I tried twice and only got about halfway both times) so I don't know if there are things I missed.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, it might not be "positive" in the sense that Hogarth isn't a terribly good person and that a messy love triangle isn't a positive outcome, but honestly? I thought she was one of the best supporting characters in the series. She's not nice, no. But she's fiercely intelligent, ambitious and driven. Her affair with her secretary and cheating on her wife looked bad on her. But on the other hand, male characters are allowed to be like that quite frequently: complex, amoral, the occasional flash of vulnerability that keeps the audience from completely turning away. Hogarth wasn't about being a positive lesbian role model, she was... well, Hogarth. It helps that Carrie-Anne Moss did such an amazing job in the role, too.

[(Anonymous)]

Imagine watching shows for the slash potential instead of the plot. Honestly, mainstream tv is table scraps if you're really looking for gay stuff. When the last time there's been popular show with a gay lead? Read gay lit or webcomics instead.

[(Anonymous)]

how do you define "popular" and also "gay"

Will and Grace

[(Anonymous)]

It's on again and half the leads are gay.

DC's Legends of Tomorrow (not sure how popular you would call it).

With main cast, but supporting gay characters:
Empire
How to Get Away with Murder
Grey's Anatomy
Lethal Weapon
Scandal
NCIS: New Orleans
9-1-1

[(Anonymous)]

Last year. Black Sails, the main character was in love with a man, ran for 4 seasons. And for queer ladies, The 100 has a bisexual main character and The Good Fight a lesbian one.

[(Anonymous)]

Even if a show doesn't have an canon queer characters, I'm extremely skeptical of most queerbaiting accusations. Most of the time people are just seeing chemistry that wasn't meant to be there, and it's not anything the writers put in on purpose to make people watch in hopes that there would be queer representation. Not that many writers have their minds on that part of the fandom.

[(Anonymous)]

Queerbaiting is definitely a thing, but it isn't nearly as pervasive as this type of fan wants to pretend. In their world, any time two characters they ship look at each other it's queerbaiting.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't know. I get where you're coming from, I think there's a lot of truth to your point, but it's also incomplete.

for one thing, I think there's probably a conversation to be had about which characters are allowed to be queer and which characters aren't. I certainly don't think that it's happened across the board. And so, while it's unequivocally good that there are more queer characters, I think people have the right to point it out if those queer characters are predominantly secondary background characters. That's still not an entirely satisfactory outcome. And I think that you can have queer characters on your show, and at the same time, do something queer-bait-y with other characters. It's not an either-or proposition.

I also think, just in general, it would probably be better if we were more specific about what shows are or are not queerbaiting, because the specifics do genuinely matter a lot. IDK.

[cbrachyrhynchos]

It doesn't help that most of the "coding" and "subtext" of the shows that draw accusations of queerbaiting are tissue thin.

[(Anonymous)]

The examples you've listed are pretty good, but hardly the norm.

[(Anonymous)]

Because shows and books with plots and settings I like are usually cis and het. :( That's just how it works out?

[(Anonymous)]

I think the more important question is "why aren't there more shows with canon queer characters?" Let's put the responsibility where it belongs: on the creators of the shows. Because don't give me that "most shows" crap.

Until it really is "most" shows, I'm not going to tell people they can't look for a character/relationship they want in a show they enjoy or force them to watch a show they don't enjoy just because it has a (probably minor, probably unhappy or sad-ending) queer character/relationship.

[(Anonymous)]

“Most shows”

What planet are you from

[(Anonymous)]

I miss when you could just enjoy a subtext pairing for what it was, without half the fandom ready to rip the writers' heads off, if it doesn't become canon. Especially in femslash fandoms. Just like... chill and fill A03 with porn, like the old days.

(I say this AS a queer woman, btw - who wants calm fandoms with loads of filthy content. Not wanky asshole fandoms.)

[mrs_don_draper]

Who on Sunny is supposed to be/baited as queer???

And on CEG, Darryl is a canon queer character. I'd like them to confirm it for Rebecca too, but it seems like she has more pressing matters to worry about before questioning her sexuality. I'd honestly rather see her get healthy/healthier first before diving into her sexual exploration!

[(Anonymous)]

Ah yes. So let's blame fans for being queerbaited rather than showrunners for doing it only to go "lol no homo you filthy gays, be content with whatever token LGBT side character we give you to fill our diversity quota."

[(Anonymous)]

what shows are the people in these comments watching because like, i dont even watch much television and i can pick a recent comedy/drama out of a hat that will guaranteed have queer characters in it

[(Anonymous)]

You clearly don't understand what queer baiting is. Queer baiting doesn't just mean subtext writing fumble that has slash potential. Queer baiting is toying with fans expectations by making false promises of LGBT relationships, enticing fans by using wordplay, making their actors play it up, write characters that are deliberately coded as LGBT, only to go lolhet at the end. I'll take a canon that has a gay character and manages to queerbait: Riverdale.

The Betty/Veronica kiss was meant nothing more to entice and titulate. They play it up further by having the actresses say stuff such as beronica forever, tease at it, only to double down on fans asking on it possible happening by saying "lol what?? Girls loving each other romantically??? That's weird they're just gals being pals but we'll continue to tease you and profit off you beronica fans for views." <--- THAT'S QUEERBAITING

Kevin is a side character and is gay. That's it. That's his whole character a gay stereotype best friend. That's NOT queerbaiting yet you expect me to be happy with scraps of representation so that makes any other queerbaiting they do on the show okay? Nah fuck off mate. The problem is the shoemakers who do this shit. Not LGBT people or slash fans who want significant gay relationships.