[ SECRET POST #2185 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2185 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[not a repeat; was broken yesterday]


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[not a repeat; was broken yesterday]


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 034 secrets from Secret Submission Post #312.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

09. http://i.imgur.com/RxrIS.jpg

[shishmish]

Fine I have no soul *shrugs*; he was the whiniest of the lot when it came to his regeneration. No one else flailed and cried, they just let it happen.

[(Anonymous)]

There must be a lot of soul-less people in the world, then.

[(Anonymous)]

Funny. I'd always assumed if people had watched the season and didn't interpret it as whiny that their heads were probably shoved too far up RTD and David Tennant's asses to see reason.

[(Anonymous)]

I KNEW IT. I KNEW I HAD NO SOUL.

*dances*

[fauxkaren]

I don't get why people see it as whiny either tbh. Ten established earlier that he feels like regeneration is a kind of death. And he didn't want to die. But then he did to save Wilf? IDK. I never understood why people hated it so much.

What scene is this?

[(Anonymous)]

I've watched all of Nu Who, but a picture of sad looking Ten is so non-specific it's stupid.

Also...as I was typing that out, I realized...Ten. Tennant. Ten-nant. I can't believe I never noticed that before.

[(Anonymous)]

OMFG Ten drove me batshit. Out of eleven incarnations of The Doctor, his is the one that made me stop watching the show until the new one showed up. I did a Snoopy Dance when he left.

[othellia]

I love 10, but that was a whole lot of whine. I like it a lot more now that I see it as a send off to the RTD era rather than just 10 in particular, but when the episodes first came out I remember going, "Get on with it!"

[intrigueing]

I gotta say, the outburst wasn't what made him whiny. It was everything else -- the prolonged angsting during the specials about his upcoming regeneration (NOT DEATH -- you've regenerated nine times you dope, and there's nothing particularly different about this one), the grand tour of his friends, which came off as a passive aggressive "fuck you" to his successor, as though he thought that he wouldn't care about them anymore (even Sarah Jane, who was Three and Four's companion!) when he regenerated, and the "I don't want to go" right at the end.

The rant itself, seeing as it came right after he had prepared himself to die with Rassilon and thought he had beaten the prophecy when he turned out to still be alive, I could have forgiven as being an understandable stressed-out outburst of frustration at finding the one moderately non-shitty thing to happen to him in ages torn away from him in such an inane manner before he got to enjoy it, but since it was surrounded by so much other irritating crap that was so obviously RTD throwing a self-indulgent diva party, it failed to affect me the way it might have if handled better.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm a huge Ten fangirl and even I thought that scene was a bit much. I didn't want my Doctor to go out ranting and crying, I wanted him to have an awesome and dignified regeneration scene, like Nine, and all the other previous Doctor's did (well... most *cough-Six-cough*). Although I do still love the line "it would be my honour" to Wilf. That kinda saved that scene for me, and put a little more dignity into it.

[wldcatsprstr_14]

Wouldn't call it whiny.

He was shocked. He spent all this time trying to avoid dying at the Master's hand and then his death sneaks up in the most unassuming and unexpected place. For the guy with a god complex, that's gonna throw you off and, if you don't want to die (which he didn't), make you very angry.

[(Anonymous)]

I can't believe people called that whiny.

Again: he was the most human doctor.

He said regenerations felt like dying to him.

what are humans most afraid of? Death.

Maybe you didn't like him or that scene because he behaved like you would have. So human.
He saved the world so many times and what did it give back to him?
Who wouldn't be angry? Or sad?
This regeneration was unlike others. It didn't happen out of a moment. he had to prepare for it. He KNEW it was coming. (And Eleven learnt from that, when he faced the astronaut.)

I can't believe there are people who pick their favourite regeneration... It's always the doctor. And whatever changed him in his new generation is the result of what happened before. You guys should remember that.

and next time you fall and scrape your knee: Don't be whiny.

[masakochan]

Whiny? Not really. Melodramatic? Definitely.

I mean, sure, he's the 'most human' of the Doctors, and is scared of death, but between the whole thing from 'The New Doctor' with "I'm going to die. I'll die while a new man just walks away.", him going on at Wilf about how much more important he (the Doctor) is, and "I could do so. much. MORE."- there was an invisible 5 year-old stomping their foot somewhere. (That's not including his long death sequence at the end of the episode).

[(Anonymous)]

Just popping in to say that I agree with this. Don't feel like getting into a huge Internet debate tonight, but yeah. The Doctor has been through some pretty unimaginable stuff, and I think his reaction was completely fine. Yes, he's still the same man every time, but each time his personality is a bit different, and I think it's totally reasonable for Ten to have different feelings about regeneration.

[(Anonymous)]

Of course I don't. I sold it to Milhouse.

[(Anonymous)]

For everyone who excuses him by saying he was the most 'human' of the Doctors, I'd like to say in response - Five.

Five (Peter Davison) was probably just as human as Ten, in terms of his compassion and vulnerability. He also had a similar ending in having to sacrifice himself to save his companion, Peri. Did he have any objections to this? None what so bloody ever. He let her take the cure and then died in her arms. Perfectly done.

[(Anonymous)]

Sorry, OP, I found this bit especially LOLtastic as well.

[maverickz3r0]

Ehhh...I have to disagree with people who think he treated regenerating wrong, too, I think.

It may be unintentional or just subtle, but. I remember how they (can't recall who, might've been RTD) said that Ten had Rose's accent because he sort of 'imprinted' on her the way a baby chick would its mother. And what Rose says to Ten when they get to talking near the end of his first special is (paraphrased from memory) 'You're not my Doctor.' She's not the only one, numerous people reiterate this. So it's quite easy to think that, in a time where he was still forming his new identity, all this 'not my Doctor' stuff he was hearing would've left a mark of some kind. That mark being, 'I am pretty much a different person in each regeneration.'

Which would give Ten the view he has in End of Time. He's a different Doctor when he regenerates. He's not the same person. Ergo, it's like dying. Who else does he have around him to insist otherwise? The only other Gallifreyan around is The Master, and he really is dying and certainly not in any shape to remind The Doctor that regenerating is not death--not like he would anyway. He's around humans, and one other Time Lord who is dying.

Should be normal to him, done it before, yadda yadda. Maybe. People can get scared of things they have done before, you know? Considering as this particular thing involves changing himself almost entirely, and he's been around almost nothing but humans, who last time he regenerated said initially he wasn't the same person as he was before? Very understandable.

Anyway: He liked being who he was as Ten. The change could've been for the worse or the better and he didn't know which, he just knew he liked being who he was and didn't want to have to make the change. (It wasn't...really a choice, even.) He was afraid. A breakdown in those circumstances was understandable.

...And yeah, I really liked Ten. I liked RTD running the show way better than anything I've seen out of Moffat running it. I feel like Moffat is somewhat like George Lucas; when he has someone else with a controlling hand in things he can turn out brilliance, but left in charge entirely on his own he goes more than a little whackadoodle.

[omorka]

Oh, it was whiny as hell. But that's not the least bit OOC for Ten; he whined about every damn thing. So I don't think it was unexpected or problematic. (Taking forever to actually go into the regeneration cycle, now, that was problematic. They could have found a better way to do the companion montage.)

Seriously, the Doctor is crap at regeneration and doesn't like doing it, totally aside from the massive physical damage & pain bit (which is probably worth a whine or two on its own). One waited until his body died of old age to do it, despite his incessant griping about being old. If Six had had the opportunity to be angsty and awful about his regeneration, he would've; it's only an artifact of the external circumstances that he didn't get the chance. And I'll bet dollars to doughnuts Eleven is going to be a pill about it, too, if it's not sudden.

[(Anonymous)]

I kinda mentally class at people who are huffy over 10's death/regeneration in with the people who think Shinji (Evangelion) just needs to man up and stop whining, battling the apocalypse in horrific conditions is nothing.

[(Anonymous)]

OP, I love you. :)
We are completely in agreement.
Ten faced so much in this episode; it's no wonder he was too emotionally-overloaded by the end (post-committing genocide on his race for the second time and having to confront all the things frorm the Time War that he was trying to repress) that he wasn't quite able to go out with the same grace.
I'd liken it to Eight's regeneration into Nine (which, reminder, we never got to see (but which we know was pretty traumatic, seeing as Nine indicates to Rose that he's been too apathetic/lost to even look in a mirror since he last regenerated)), only possibly with even more trauma for Ten, seeing as he's now had to see his species die and face the insanity of the Time War for the second time.

tl;dr: Consider context.

[(Anonymous)]

Same, OP, same.

[tenlittlebullets]

Guess I have no soul then.

And, you know, I wanted so badly to like End of Time. I kind of sadomasochistically love what a messed-up puppy Ten is, and I really really wanted to see him finally come to grips with his demons and lay them to rest. Instead, even after he's finally laid the Time Lords to rest, the prospect of laying down one of his lives for a friend and regenerating sends him into a tantrum that could fit, word for word, into the final scenes of Waters of Mars. It's not even that Ten is a horrible person, because I kind of enjoy it when Ten is a horrible person; it's that he gets no growth, no resolution, he just gets more and more broken until he decides to give up and throw in the towel and hope his next self is better.

You can see it, right there at the end of that monologue--he brings himself up short and goes "I've lived too long." It's like he just realized that he's never going to be able to fix what a fuck-up he is without becoming a different person: this is it, his final moments have arrived, and here he is throwing a selfish tantrum at a frightened old man about how "I could do so much more" when he can't even stop his own downward spiral. In the end, he doesn't grow or make himself a better person or work through any of his multitudes of issues, he just sort of accepts his own inability to deal with them and remains a selfish self-pitying fuck-up until the end. That's not a satisfying ending; that's fucking soul-crushing, and I really, truly wanted better for him.

(And this is why, even though RTD writes the emotional heroin of my heart, I also really love what Moffat is doing, which is taking the character RTD broke and putting him back together. Ten never did claw his way towards any sort of peace, but maybe Eleven can do it for him.)

[(Anonymous)]

"Oh my god I'm going to DIIIIIIIE it's so UNFAIIIIIIIIIIRRRRRRR whaaaaaaa I miss ROOOOOOOOSE ..."

Yeah, no, I was glad to see him go by that point. I loved Ten, but his final episodes made me want him to regenerate already and stop moping.

The fact that he's whining about having to "die" while in front of Wilfred, a pretty old dude who's not going to live longer than say, thirty years if he's lucky, also rankles me. Yeah, you're gonna regenerate into a new hot young body and live forever going through time and space picking up hot chicks and retain all your memories from previous incarnations, oh the horrors, Ten.